What type of filter? - Page 3 - Betta Fish and Betta Fish Care
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post #21 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-18-2013, 10:51 PM Thread Starter
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The fish that passed were young cichlid fry. My boyfriends brother took the young fry from his dads cichlid tank to start his tank (yes, it's too small of a tank for cichlids). They were probably a week oldish. They spent a day fishing out all the babies when they noticed them.

But, no matter what the thought of a fish being sucked into a filter (healthy or not) is pretty upsetting to me.

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post #22 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-18-2013, 11:08 PM
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Yes, I maintain that a healthy fish will not be killed by the filter. In the 1 week old betta example - there's no way for you to know that the fish that were sucked up were healthy. Too, one could easily argue that such a loss would be a result of user error - obviously not a good choice for filtration for the application.

You are welcome to argue that healthy fish are killed by filters if you like. I'm not sure how many examples of such "Healthy" fish being killed by the filter you can come up with, but for every one I am sure there are countless examples of healthy (and sick) fish that manage to not be killed by the filter.

So the week old fry were shredded into little pieces...even smaller than their whole selves, and these tiny pieces of tiny fish were too big to get sucked through the strainer. Okay. So skip the filter. I though NPTs weren't supposed to have filters anyway. Or is that just walstad tanks?

125 - BGK, chanchito cichlid, pictus cats, silver dollars, palmas bichir
125 - cichlids (severums, bolivian rams, chocolate), rainbows ( turquoise, red), loaches (angelicus, zebra, kuhli and horseface), plecos (BN, RL and clown), denison barbs, tiretrack eel, pearl gouramis, betta
90 - Congo tetras, african knife, upside down cats, spotted ctenopoma, kribensis, delhezzi bichir
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Last edited by jaysee; 07-18-2013 at 11:21 PM.
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post #23 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 09:52 AM
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Well if you did sponge filters you really wouldn't have to worry about fish getting sucked up onto the filter so that would be nice.

Oh yeah, forgot this was an NPT as well so you probably won't need double the filtration as I had suggested earlier. So just one sponge filter would be fine then if you still wanted a filter

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post #24 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 10:04 AM Thread Starter
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So, even if I did a community tank with Betta, dwarf loaches, RCS, MTS and guppys I wouldn't need a filter?

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post #25 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 10:07 AM
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If it's a true NPT, then no you won't need a filter. But I know that when it's first set up quite often you need to keep a close eye on the water parameter's because it fluctuates quite a bit the first month or so I believe and after that it will stabilize out and you won't have to do weekly water changes and stuff like that. But if you're just doing a regular Planted Tank, then yes you should get a filter still.

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post #26 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by jaysee View Post
Filters don't kill fish. Fish that are either dying or already dead and are collected by filters. 1 day old cichlid fry are capable of not being sucked into the filter.

I'm not trying to trying to be argumentative, but your fear of filters is totally irrational. That's like saying "My friend was in a car accident while in an SUV, so I'm never riding in an SUV again." Or, "My friend got sick from the steak they ate last night, so I'm never eating meat again."
What kind of fry are you raising? Yes fry will get sucked up into filters they get sucked up into the hose when you do a wc. Maybe if you have a really really weak filter that is set super low the fry might have a chance st not getting sucked up. I agree larger healthy fish will not die from the filter they will die from poor water quality due to lack of filter.

But you are right don't fear the filter. There are lots of things you can do to make them safe. I have put sponges on the intake of filters to keep fry and baby shrimp from getting up it. Or I rip up the mesh bath spong and use that mesh on my filter intakes so the holes are so small not even shrimp babies can get in.

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Last edited by snowflake311; 07-19-2013 at 10:53 AM.
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post #27 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 11:02 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilnaugrim View Post
If it's a true NPT, then no you won't need a filter. But I know that when it's first set up quite often you need to keep a close eye on the water parameter's because it fluctuates quite a bit the first month or so I believe and after that it will stabilize out and you won't have to do weekly water changes and stuff like that. But if you're just doing a regular Planted Tank, then yes you should get a filter still.
It's going to be a true NPT. I'm going to use soil with a black sand cap. I was following OFL's thread, and she mentioned the use of a filter. I thought NPT did not need them, but since she mentioned it I figured it was needed.

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post #28 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by snowflake311 View Post
What kind of fry are you raising? Yes fry will get sucked up into filters they get sucked up into the hose when you do a wc. Maybe if you have a really really weak filter that is set super low the fry might have a chance st not getting sucked up. I agree larger healthy fish will not die from the filter they will die from poor water quality due to lack of filter.

But you are right don't fear the filter. There are lots of things you can do to make them safe. I have put sponges on the intake of filters to keep fry and baby shrimp from getting up it. Or I rip up the mesh bath spong and use that mesh on my filter intakes so the holes are so small not even shrimp babies can get in.
I've had convict and chanchito fry. On the 55 with the chanchitos, I had an XP2 (300 GPH) and a sunsun 302 canister (265 GPH). Certainly not weak by any stretch of the imagination.


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125 - BGK, chanchito cichlid, pictus cats, silver dollars, palmas bichir
125 - cichlids (severums, bolivian rams, chocolate), rainbows ( turquoise, red), loaches (angelicus, zebra, kuhli and horseface), plecos (BN, RL and clown), denison barbs, tiretrack eel, pearl gouramis, betta
90 - Congo tetras, african knife, upside down cats, spotted ctenopoma, kribensis, delhezzi bichir
2.5 - betta
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post #29 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-19-2013, 11:59 PM
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only thing I've ever had go up the intake of any filter were baby red cherry shrimp... however they lived. When I noticed them maybe a day or two later I just turned off the filter took them out (I had two sections of the intake both with mesh or holes *whatever..can't think of the name lol*) they were saved by the second section of the intake and put them back in the tank and were fine. You shoud never let that be a deciding factor on if you filter your tank or not. There are shrimp guards..that work for small fish too that you can order and plave over your intake.
On cichlid fry... my youngest cichlids ( not true fry anymore..about an inch) actualy enjoy playing in the Vacuum as I do water changes. Thay are healthy and strong enough to fight the suction and play in there Couldn't imagine at any age those guys going up an intake.
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post #30 of 30 (permalink) Old 07-20-2013, 03:43 AM
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I have a planted 20G - not a NPT but I do have plant specific substrate. ANyways, I have a HOB and a sponge filter in addition to the plants. I kept the HOB because there are some heavy duty poopers in that tank (lots of snails and 2 clown plecos) and I wanted more mechanical filtration. Where the tank is, I cant add a bigger HOB as they wont fit ( I tried) and that's why I added the sponge. Plus I figured the bubbles would help add oxygen for the plecos. I guess the plants would do that too?

Plus with sponge filters you can get an attachemnt thingy that allows you to control the airflow and allows you to run several sponges off one pump which is nice cause I only have so many electrical outlets.

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