I am even killing the moss balls - Page 2 - Betta Fish and Betta Fish Care
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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-19-2014, 06:56 PM
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Hard to make a diagnosis. Need close ups of each plant. Reddening, bronzing of leaves is a natural response to high lighting conditions, but you're making it sound like something else is afoot. Are the leaves losing structural integrity? Close ups would be a big help

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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-19-2014, 09:20 PM Thread Starter
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This is a photo I took yesterday, earlier today I trimmed back the taller leafs. The leafs are turning brown with the veins staying greener, but eventually even they darken, the leaf also has an almost opaque thing going on, like the tissue itself is getting thinner. My instincts with land based plants also tell me this is an issue with too much light and the plant is adjusting but I only had two 6W bulbs in there giving me 1.2W per gallon and all I keep reading is you need 2-4W a gallon that tells me I don't have enough lite? Yesterday I put two 13W bulbs in giving me 2.6W a gallon in the range they say you should have. Still my instinct is telling me to put the lower watt bulbs back in.
[IMG][/IMG]

The moss balls turning brown I am guessing, as has been mentioned, is the liquid fertilizer I've pulled them out and put them in mason jars.
[IMG][/IMG]
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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-19-2014, 09:39 PM
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A close up shot of one leaf surface would have been better, but I think I can put two and two together based on what you've said...

Good news: it isn't a lighting issue, it is a phosphorous deficiency issue.
Phosphorous deficiency in plants is marked with the yellowing and bro wining of the leaves and darkening of the veins. Older leaves are usually the first to go.
Certain types of substrate are capable of binding phosphates from the water column preventing the plants from utilizing. These substrates will not release the binded phosphates until they are saturated.
Solution: increase your phosphate levels.

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-19-2014, 09:47 PM
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I am pretty sure that the sword turning "brown" is a red melon/rubin sword plant and is adjusting to your tank and water parameters. That might be wrong but it looks right. Alot of plants are grown emersed, out of water, and need to adjust to being in water when they are bought. This causes melting and some die off but they should recover. I am doubtful it's a light problem, esp since you are doing with really good ferts.

The grassy looking green plant, could you get a closer picture of it for me? I can't tell what it is but it doesn't look like a moss to me but I could be wrong.
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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 07:25 AM
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Turning brown and sort of transparent sounds like it's melting and should come back eventually but amphirions suggestions sound correct and I would follow that.

Also, just wanted to comment that the "watt per gallon" rule has long been outdated, not that you would particularly know, just wanted to put that out there. Wattage is just how much electricity is being used, it doesn't necessarily mean that the light is stronger, make sense? I believe color is more important, more or less in these situations.

EDIT: also yeah, with the closer picture of the 'grassy' plant, yeah sorry that's not java moss >.< the first pictures made it look like it. However, I do not believe it is Sagittaria either which would be thicker. Looks more like Micro Sword.

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post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 09:23 AM Thread Starter
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Took a close up of it. I really should have written down the name of it, it even had one of those plastic tabs with the name on it. At any rate it did come in a pot and had a pretty good root ball going.
[IMG][/IMG]

Ok now a question about the phosphate. I read the bottle of the Brightwell Multinutrient and it doesn't have any phosphorus or nitrogen, just some potasium along with a bunch of other elements. per the bottle it says "our extensive experiance with planted aquarium husbandry has led us to believe that these nutrients ( referring to nitrogen and phosphorus) should be added by the hobbyist when desired."
So I am guessing that if I need to add some phosphate I need to get something else?
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post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 10:59 AM
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Sounds about right. Under normal circumstances, nitrogen and phosphorus should not be limited in the aquarium. I never had a phosphate issue in my years of experience until I utilized volcanic lace rock and Akadama as my substrate. That combo apparently worked to bind all my phosphates completely and I saw many of my beautiful plants melt in the course of 3 weeks. If your flourish is anything like my Akadama, it could be considered as the culprit. Some plants will react quicker to nutrient deficiencies than others. I know many swords are considered iron hogs.

Here's the nutrient you need: http://www.marinedepot.com/Seachem_L...FWPCLF-vi.html

I'd also recommend getting the major nutrients separated from the trace--though it looks like your solution is predominantly trace elements + K and Fe. I would personally like to keep the major nutrients from the minors since the majors are consumed more rapidly, leaving excess of traces.
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post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 11:22 AM
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It's simple they are starving. Plants need nitrate and other food. But nitrates is what planets craze.

You have a new tank with not fish or any thing. Look into frets.

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post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 12:24 PM Thread Starter
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Ok thanks for the help Amphirion and every one else!!! Just order a bottle of the phosphorus and also a bottle of the nitrogen, cause no don't have a fish in there yet and my well water tests 0ppm for nitrates. Since new to this want to get a handle taking care of the plants, then will put a Betta in there.
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post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2014, 04:05 PM
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Your sward plants will do well if you use insert ferts that go down by the root they are heavy root feeding plants.

You also need co2 doing wc can add some co2 but the fish will naturally add co2 if you are not dosing it.

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