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Old 06-21-2012, 02:55 PM   #11 
Anitax3x
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Sorry I was in the lab writing that post and I did not complete it.

I don't know if that was meant to be condescending or not, but no I have not been just keeping a betta in a bowl....


Its municipal and I think I stated earlier that I have a halfmoon male who has kept his fin integrity the past year I've had him. I currently am in the process of switching over to naturally planted tanks as I have seen my betta's thrive in them. I have taken my water to petco however all they did was throw a strip in tell me everything is fine and That was the end of that. So I plan on buying a master test kit (drops) to check out my water prams, I just havent bought one because some people say you absolutely need them some say if you do the water changes you're safe, so I just decided to spare that expense.

I'm just asking questions to know what are the best options, I'm not 12 and I've been keeping betta's in actual tanks with heaters some with filters some without. Just because someone asks questions doesn't mean you should assume I have no experience in fish keeping. I don't know if you meant to be rude or not but that came off insulting.

Anyways thanks to all who actually told me different methods you used.


I'm currently raising molly fry, and have found it to be fun raising fish, and I wanted to read up, and try starting a line of quality halfmoon bettas. I haven't even done this spawn, and I'm planning A YEAR ahead learning and researching while I keep my pet store fish.


As far as health of my fish, I have good reports, the only recent death I have is that of a male who I bought from petco a year ago,I assume he died of old age because he gradually deteriorated over the course of a couple months, stopped eating, and died. I have had NO random deaths, My fish are vibrant, active, healthy eaters and poop just fine. So it is possible to assume that My water is safe, however If I were to age water as indjo suggested I think it might be a better plan as I can grow micro critters, food for the fry and I can create a more natural environment.


Thanks for your help guys


Oh and for fin form, I have been studying male form however for females I am unsure. Do I look for females who will potentially balance out the faults present in the male? Do their fins fall in the same shape as far as branching and the straight edges?

I want to make sure that I can find the closest match to "perfect" halfmoon form.
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Old 06-21-2012, 03:56 PM   #12 
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Form

So I decided to make some diagrams to help match potential mates by using Kanki and Pandora's sell photos.





Pandora's Photo

A. This is to explain the front ray of the dorsal needs to be long and pointing forward. As you can tell Kanki's does so but Pandora does not, it is short and stair steps so Kanki is key for fixing this issue. It is harder to find the long front ray in a female than a male.

B. A strong 180 spread in the female is just as important as in the male, look for a female who has a very strong 180 caudal edge and does not round prematurely.

C. The arrow is pointing at the two lines regarding her body form. You want a spindle shape in a female which she has. A bumpy, dippy female is no good.

D. Just as a male look for that arc that smoothly goes through the Dorsal, Caudal and Anal fin without being interrupted. As you can see, Pandora's anal is slightly long, once again why Kanki's short anal(Look for a rectangle shape when examining anals) is good to balance her out with.

Kanki's Photo (I redid the photo so you may see the old photo before the new one replaces it)

A. A long front ray.

B. Knife shaped ventral's that the edge points backward. Ventral's are somewhat hard to judge in a female.

C. A perfect arc through all of the fins, he is nice and balanced.

D. Just something to throw in here, The dorsal should be half the length of the body with a nice broad base. In females I believe that the dorsal is set back further than in males.

I thought showing with real fish is easier than a diagram. About branching, look for females that have clean cut fins like Kanki's if you can, Pandora has slightly excessive branching at the ends but has very long first branching.

If I pointed out something that isn't correct please mention so. I did these diagrams on the knowledge I know of the IBC standard.

Good Links:

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=104371

http://bettysplendens.com/articles/p...?articleid=775

-Sincerely
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:00 PM   #13 
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Originally Posted by Anitax3x View Post
Sorry I was in the lab writing that post and I did not complete it.

I don't know if that was meant to be condescending or not, but no I have not been just keeping a betta in a bowl....

Not condescending, just blunt and mater of fact. If you have experience, then why be upset? I see many fails here due to the fact that they are ill prepared and seem to have zero experience at keeping fish, much less breeding... If you are going to always be defensive to every bit of advice, then why ask the questions? It is tiring to see so many "I only have one fry left" stories, and they haven't even begun to see the work involved...

Straight and to the point: Breeding Betta's is not the same as keeping a Betta in a bowl. Expect the workload to be X100 from what you are used to even keeping 5 to 10 Betta's in various aquarium.. Hundreds of fry in jars require many gallons of aged conditioned up to temp water every day.

And what does not being 12 suppose to mean? Age has nothing to do with it. Are you being condescending to the younger Betta keepers??? ACK!!!

Best of luck with your future breeding. Just try to keep your ego in check...

Jeff.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:05 PM   #14 
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Perfection. Now I have a much better understanding. Thank you Sincerely that was MOST helpful!

Any other advice ? anything that has personally helped you all in your breeding?
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:11 PM   #15 
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Originally Posted by jeffegg2 View Post
Not condescending, just blunt and mater of fact. If you have experience, then why be upset? I see many fails here due to the fact that they are ill prepared and seem to have zero experience at keeping fish, much less breeding... If you are going to always be defensive to every bit of advice, then why ask the questions? It is tiring to see so many "I only have one fry left" stories, and they haven't even begun to see the work involved...

Straight and to the point: Breeding Betta's is not the same as keeping a Betta in a bowl. Expect the workload to be X100 from what you are used to even keeping 5 to 10 Betta's in various aquarium.. Hundreds of fry in jars require many gallons of aged conditioned up to temp water every day.

And what does not being 12 suppose to mean? Age has nothing to do with it. Are you being condescending to the younger Betta keepers??? ACK!!!

Best of luck with your future breeding. Just try to keep your ego in check...

Jeff.



.... how did you pull that I'm against young breeders out of that? That was a major assumption

I was saying I don't like to be talked to as if I'm 12. That is all

Ego? Seriously? If I had an ego, this would be a spawn log, and I'd have probably killed most of my fish

I have NOTHING against young betta keepers, in fact most of them know more than I do and I'm 22

I understand that breeding requires a ton of funds and time, which is why I'm asking before I get into it and end up SOL with dead fry

I realize it is frustrating to see stories of "oh I'm spawning with my petco fish because I want to breed" And I'm sorry that it hurts you because It is frustrating to see the fish pay for a lack of research.

Don't assume I'm one of them just because I ask questions and You assumed ALOT from what I actually said. RELAX I just want to be talked to with some kind of courtesy, instead of you straight out the gate assuming I'm ignorant and will kill all of my spawn

Believe it or not at one point you were a beginner and had know idea what you were doing and asked questions.

If anyone has the ego here it is NOT me. I'm asking for help before I start, and I have the ego, oh okay

Last edited by Anitax3x; 06-21-2012 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:16 PM   #16 
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Originally Posted by Anitax3x View Post
Perfection. Now I have a much better understanding. Thank you Sincerely that was MOST helpful!

Any other advice ? anything that has personally helped you all in your breeding?
Start with the best stock you can afford that are closest to what you actually wish to end up with. Keep the water clean. The Master Water Test kit will help very much and is probably the best investment that I have made.

A 40 Gallon clean new Heavy Duty Trash Can with lid and a 200W heater helps a lot for keeping fresh clean up to temp water available and ready.

At first I hated the idea of snails because of my past experience with trying to get rid of the things... But I have 5 baby apple snails now and love them!

Again: Best of luck!

Jeff.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:30 PM   #17 
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I'm not going to buy this guy, just checking to see how I am doing with "judging" fins and form

How does this guy look?

Aside from his anal being a bit too long.
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:59 PM   #18 
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A. Dorsal sweeps backwards, un-straight first ray.

B.Ventrals would be correct length if anal was short.

C. It seems this edge curve in at the end, but it might just be the angle.

D. By doing an arc around the fins you can see that the dorsal is too short to match with the caudal and the anal is too long. Making him unbalanced.

He has a nice thick body but his topline slants a little too much for my personal taste near his head, I would like it to be more gradual. I like his branching, clean cut.

-Sincerely
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Old 06-21-2012, 05:02 PM   #19 
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Okay, I see what you are saying, and you're right! It's funny how much you see now that most these fish on AB have really BAD fins. I wonder why that is!
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Old 06-21-2012, 05:10 PM   #20 
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Okay, I see what you are saying, and you're right! It's funny how much you see now that most these fish on AB have really BAD fins. I wonder why that is!
I assume that is because not all buyers are looking for breeders. They make wonderful pets, and lets face it, only a few of each spawn are going to be show worthy.
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