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Old 10-16-2012, 05:48 AM   #21 
azurefox
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Originally Posted by OrangeAugust View Post
Yes, definitely overstocked! Otos are about 2-3 inches long, right? So you'd really only be able to have one in a 5 gallon with a betta (there's a 1 gallon-per-inch-of-fish guideline.) But since Otos and Cories are shoaling fish, you can't have just one in the tank. The only tank mates you can have with a betta in a 5 gallon are one snail OR a few shrimp OR an African Dwarf Frog.
Your betta may be stressed out from having so many other fish in his tank. Stress can cause colors to fade.
uhm..... wow...I don't know about that....O.O it can be...*confuse..*
my Betta is still in his isolating tanks..I still watching him closely, to make sure that he is 100% healthy... I'll try to move all otos and cories for a while before adding my betta in the 5 gallon again..and see his condition :)
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Old 10-16-2012, 05:55 AM   #22 
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Originally Posted by Sena Hansler View Post
I meant permanently.

And good to know he is doing better!! :)
thank you so much!
looks like He got fin rot T_T
I saw his dorsal fin looked pale and transparant on the edge even almost all the color back again..
and his tail have a minor 1 hole and ripped a little...
but after I put the Rid All General Aid, his dorsal fin fully cured..no transparent side at all..only hope that his tail will re-grow again... >.<

his colour is back fully too :)
I'm afraid the he got some parasites too, because sometimes he try to scratch his body against the tank wall at the bottom side..:(

still watching closely tho.. maybe I'll continue the treatment with Rid-All Anti Ich after this...
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Old 10-16-2012, 08:35 AM   #23 
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Welcome.. I may repeat what has been said already, but will try to make sure to give you some new information as I go :)

Sunlight is fine for the fish.. you are looking at wanting to do a 10/14 and up to 12/12 hours per day (lights on / off). It will help give them the down time they need, as well as to avoid a huge algae outbreak.

Quote:
Originally Posted by azurefox View Post
ah..for food.
I only gave him dried small worms >.<
he doesn't like pellets
live worms, I'm afraid with parasites, heard they sometimes bring parasites...

in day time I see my fish colour also pale :(
especialy when the light is on.. I can see his fin so pale..
but his behaviour still the same..sooo.. I don't know..
maybe I try sunlight and variation of diet first...
You may have to force pellets on him, only offer him pellets and eventually he will feed, as he won't starve himself to death. I find Omega One Betta Buffet to please even the pickiest of eaters. It all comes down to the brand of pellets you use- lower quality (cheap) that is mostly plant base (wheat as first ingredient) will not be as appetizing to them and their senses (of smell). But pellets that have a lot of meat/fish product will seem yummy to them.

Fish always have parasite within them, it's when certain circumstances happen that they attack and cause trouble. Live foods tend to be just fine, especially if you "make" them yourself. Place a bucket of water outside with some grass and twigs in it.. using a small net (shrimp net if possible) you can then scoop out the daphnea and mosquito larvae. Just a quick rinse and feed! By collecting the food that way, you shouldn't have to worry about the larvae harboring any diseases/pests.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aokashi View Post
dried worms often causes bloat... if you starve him for a week Im sure he'll eat any pellet....

as for the color, get a mirror and flare him. in sunlight, the betta should be lighter....
maybe your tank and substrate is too bright?
Freeze dried foods don't cause bloat- the system doesn't work that way. It's over feeding, and over feeding low quality food that does it. Freeze dried being a low quality food that is easily over fed causes it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrangeAugust View Post
Yes, definitely overstocked! Otos are about 2-3 inches long, right? So you'd really only be able to have one in a 5 gallon with a betta (there's a 1 gallon-per-inch-of-fish guideline.) But since Otos and Cories are shoaling fish, you can't have just one in the tank. The only tank mates you can have with a betta in a 5 gallon are one snail OR a few shrimp OR an African Dwarf Frog.
Your betta may be stressed out from having so many other fish in his tank. Stress can cause colors to fade.
The 1inch per gallon rule was dropped a couple decades ago.. as it's not about the size of the tank & fish, but how much the system can hold, along with the fish becoming territorial/feeling trapped. In a 5 gallon it is recommended to have 1 betta with 1 snail, or 1 betta with some ghost/cherry shrimp or 2 bettas divided (bettas tend not to create as much ammonia as other fish) so having 2 in the tank won't be detrimental to the tank as long as you do your weekly water changes.
Ottos require large groups in large tanks that are very heavily planted with live plants along with being fed different veggies and algae wafers.. they starve easily.
Cories do best in groups of 4+ in tanks of 10+ gallons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by azurefox View Post
thank you so much!
looks like He got fin rot T_T
I saw his dorsal fin looked pale and transparant on the edge even almost all the color back again..
and his tail have a minor 1 hole and ripped a little...
but after I put the Rid All General Aid, his dorsal fin fully cured..no transparent side at all..only hope that his tail will re-grow again... >.<

his colour is back fully too :)
I'm afraid the he got some parasites too, because sometimes he try to scratch his body against the tank wall at the bottom side..:(

still watching closely tho.. maybe I'll continue the treatment with Rid-All Anti Ich after this...
Is it missing pieces? Fin rot the color will be a black color.. clear/transparent/white color means fin regrowth, which is good. Make sure to remove him from the medication as it is unnecessary, especially if it is ich medication.. it can be doing harm to him rather than help him.. if you can post a picture of him it will help determine if he does or does not have rot. But if it's black and flaking off then he does. Clear/white then he doesn't.

Good luck!
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Old 10-16-2012, 09:16 AM   #24 
azurefox
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Originally Posted by Myates View Post
Welcome.. I may repeat what has been said already, but will try to make sure to give you some new information as I go :)

Sunlight is fine for the fish.. you are looking at wanting to do a 10/14 and up to 12/12 hours per day (lights on / off). It will help give them the down time they need, as well as to avoid a huge algae outbreak.



You may have to force pellets on him, only offer him pellets and eventually he will feed, as he won't starve himself to death. I find Omega One Betta Buffet to please even the pickiest of eaters. It all comes down to the brand of pellets you use- lower quality (cheap) that is mostly plant base (wheat as first ingredient) will not be as appetizing to them and their senses (of smell). But pellets that have a lot of meat/fish product will seem yummy to them.

Fish always have parasite within them, it's when certain circumstances happen that they attack and cause trouble. Live foods tend to be just fine, especially if you "make" them yourself. Place a bucket of water outside with some grass and twigs in it.. using a small net (shrimp net if possible) you can then scoop out the daphnea and mosquito larvae. Just a quick rinse and feed! By collecting the food that way, you shouldn't have to worry about the larvae harboring any diseases/pests.



Freeze dried foods don't cause bloat- the system doesn't work that way. It's over feeding, and over feeding low quality food that does it. Freeze dried being a low quality food that is easily over fed causes it.



The 1inch per gallon rule was dropped a couple decades ago.. as it's not about the size of the tank & fish, but how much the system can hold, along with the fish becoming territorial/feeling trapped. In a 5 gallon it is recommended to have 1 betta with 1 snail, or 1 betta with some ghost/cherry shrimp or 2 bettas divided (bettas tend not to create as much ammonia as other fish) so having 2 in the tank won't be detrimental to the tank as long as you do your weekly water changes.
Ottos require large groups in large tanks that are very heavily planted with live plants along with being fed different veggies and algae wafers.. they starve easily.
Cories do best in groups of 4+ in tanks of 10+ gallons.



Is it missing pieces? Fin rot the color will be a black color.. clear/transparent/white color means fin regrowth, which is good. Make sure to remove him from the medication as it is unnecessary, especially if it is ich medication.. it can be doing harm to him rather than help him.. if you can post a picture of him it will help determine if he does or does not have rot. But if it's black and flaking off then he does. Clear/white then he doesn't.

Good luck!
Hello There, thank you so much for so much information that you gave..
that really help me! :)

well, on the tail, it already ripped/and got hole on it.. I surprised because yesterday the tail seems fine..or maybe I didn't see it because his colour was so pale, I was so afraid maybe it's the symptom of fin rot after I read at many forum/betta fish articles.....
and on his dorsal fin, his dorsal fin was never ripped, that's why I'm worried because the edge looks really pale, and looks thin..while the other side is still blue..after 1 night, his dorsal fin looks fully fine now...(I quickly give the General Aid treatment after see the ripped/hole on the fin)
now his colour looks really fine, bright and he often spread out his fin like fan too... for now I give him General Aid treatment..
but I still watch his behaviour till tomorrow.. because sometimes he swims strange like I told in my last post.. :(

well about the fishes..yeah I must move them then..T_T
now I confuse, I should buy new aquarium again...hahaha..
my cory all is still Baby tho...and the Otos..2 of them adult, and 1 still small...
in this 5 gallon tank, I see that all my cories seems enjoy the tank..1 of them really love to make bubbles on the surface of the tank =.=" (I don't undersatnd this behaviour, do cory have the same habbit as betta's?)
the Otos looks comfortable in their tank too.. sometimes when I fixed something inside the tank, I put my hand in it, they didn't afraid with me... really different with the first time when I got them..

well I love all of them, but I don't have any places for more +10 gallons tank :(
but If I change my 5 gallons to 10 gallons with 1 bettas, 3 cories and 3 otos, will they be fine?

"Sunlight is fine for the fish.. you are looking at wanting to do a 10/14 and up to 12/12 hours per day (lights on / off)"-->sorry, I don't understand the 10/14 means, can u explain? >.<
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Old 10-16-2012, 12:01 PM   #25 
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10/14 = 10 hours lights on, 14 hours lights off.. I keep mine on between 10 and 12 hours a day for my fish.

I would still remove him from the medication as soon as you can/feel comfortable with. He should be fine until tomorrow, but no longer.

The fish will still swim around, etc in a smaller tank, but the amount of bio that is being placed in the tank, and eventually the space issues will come into play. You may like it, and you may think they are fine with it, but in reality it isn't healthy to have all of those in there. At least rehome the otos, those have a higher quality need, otherwise they won't live for very long.

In a 10 gallon they technically can be fine like that, but it's still a risk on the otos. Just make sure the tank is well established (tanks that have not been fully cycled (6+ weeks)) and tanks that are not densely planted with live plants are not ideal for otos.. they are sensitive and require a TON of food. Definitely research them a little more so you can make the 10 gallon work for your fish :) With the right plants and right amount, a 10 gallon can hold those fish just fine.

Oto care 1
Oto care 2
Oto care 3

Wish you the best :)
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Old 10-16-2012, 02:02 PM   #26 
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Originally Posted by Myates View Post
The 1inch per gallon rule was dropped a couple decades ago..
Ok, then how come whatever forum I go to online asking questions about stocking my future 55 gallon community tank, everyone throws the one inch per gallon rule at me?
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Old 10-16-2012, 02:18 PM   #27 
azurefox
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Originally Posted by Myates View Post
10/14 = 10 hours lights on, 14 hours lights off.. I keep mine on between 10 and 12 hours a day for my fish.

I would still remove him from the medication as soon as you can/feel comfortable with. He should be fine until tomorrow, but no longer.

The fish will still swim around, etc in a smaller tank, but the amount of bio that is being placed in the tank, and eventually the space issues will come into play. You may like it, and you may think they are fine with it, but in reality it isn't healthy to have all of those in there. At least rehome the otos, those have a higher quality need, otherwise they won't live for very long.

In a 10 gallon they technically can be fine like that, but it's still a risk on the otos. Just make sure the tank is well established (tanks that have not been fully cycled (6+ weeks)) and tanks that are not densely planted with live plants are not ideal for otos.. they are sensitive and require a TON of food. Definitely research them a little more so you can make the 10 gallon work for your fish :) With the right plants and right amount, a 10 gallon can hold those fish just fine.

Oto care 1
Oto care 2
Oto care 3

Wish you the best :)
thank you so much for the reply and advice, really helps me....
yeah looks like I really should move some of my fish to other aquarium...
anyway,
this is My Betta, I video him today..because u wanna see it..
before his colour is all pale and almost transparant :( you can see that in my previous videos, I didn't realize that, I thought it was his original colour..
but after I put him in this isolating tank, his colours got darker and darker..looks really healthy...:)
aannd He got change in his tail, the first time I bought him, almost all edge of his tail are transparant, dunno maybe because his tail is till in growing phase? now, all is almost bold blue.. :D
I don't have photo when there were hole in his tail.. it's hard to take photo my betta=.= he always swim around..


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2P8dNt7IAnU

Last edited by azurefox; 10-16-2012 at 02:22 PM.
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Old 10-16-2012, 02:20 PM   #28 
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@orangeaugust : wow., just realise ur avatar, ur fishes are all beautiful!
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Old 10-16-2012, 02:27 PM   #29 
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@orangeaugust : wow., just realise ur avatar, ur fishes are all beautiful!
Thank you!
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Old 10-16-2012, 06:07 PM   #30 
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Ok, then how come whatever forum I go to online asking questions about stocking my future 55 gallon community tank, everyone throws the one inch per gallon rule at me?
I have no clue, unsure what forums you are going to and how old they are. I go by my personal experiences for the last 20 years, along with others who have decades of experiences as well.

Some will say that it counts when you are talking about tetras such as neons, or even guppies, as those you can stock heavier in a tank. But you really still need to focus on how much bio you are placing in the tank, and the sizes of fish.

I mean, are you seriously going to place a 15 inch oscar in a 15 gallon tank?

So basically - the smaller the fish the more you can squeeze into a tank (to a point, and talking about larger tanks). Any other fish over 1" then you will want to put in less.
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