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Old 11-27-2012, 11:00 PM   #1 
Chuckee
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Question Genetic or Stunted?

I have a betta (you may have heard of my Blue DevilFish) who I would really love to reproduce. Mostly because he's beautiful, but also because, as the creature who called me back to the species, I am especially fond of him and think it would be fitting to make him my first "DaddyFish"

I have tried him twice, but now have questions before I try again:

> First off, he's particularly violent, and scares the lady fishies, despite my conditioning as per the majority of the information I've found.
To be fair, many people talk about leaving a pair together for several days, but I always get frightened for my female and pull her out in the same day... Does that make a huge difference? I might have been bold enough to leave them longer the first time, except that I had work, and refuse to leave them unsupervised for ten hours.

> He's black, white and royal with a hint of turquoise, butterfly patterned, I believe. I bought him as HM, but debate with myself occasionally about whether this is correct, or is he a super-delta?
Anyhow, since I have no concept of what the "hidden genes" may be, what would be my best chance of staying close to what he is?

> Lastly, My boy has slight curling in his fins, particularly the ventral and anal fins. I was told that this was from being kept in such a small area whilst he was growing, and that sometimes, if they're young enough, it grows out. But not long ago, I read that curled fins are a genetic trait (fault).
Is this true? And if so, how would it most likely affect offspring? Is there any chance that it could be bred out of a line fairly quickly, or is it a more tenacious gene?
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:35 PM   #2 
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I think you should jar the female and float her in the tank overnight for at least a day before releasing her.
I think the curled fin are due to small space.
If you don't know what i meant by floating her i think you should read the stickies for help.
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:11 AM   #3 
indjo
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+1 Fabian - float the female for 2-3 days before releasing.
Use lots - I mean stuff live plants in one corner or 1 half of the tank. Make it so that male/female have a hard time getting in. Add hide outs where male can't see female.

When breeding bettas, beat up female is very normal. An aggressive male will be more aggressive if you put female in and out. Let him rest in total solitary for at least 2 weeks. Then try again on a week end. Release female just before dark (don't use extra light) or at night. They should become less active at night, without light. But at the same time can sense each other. . . . make sure the female is willing/ready to breed.
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:49 AM   #4 
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The female in question -always- shows breeding stripes, until she's taken a pretty good beating (and during 100% water changes... she hates those small spaces!), and she "flirts" through the glass like she wants to.

There's a large "Amazon Sword" and some not so tall java fern, plus a few strands of Egeria planted on aprx. 1/3 of the tank, floating Egeria, Bacopa and a small bit of Java Moss. Also, there -was- dwarf grass, but they made a mess of it, and the Wisteria just up and died, except for one little frond that floated to the top and tossed out a couple little roots (?).

There's also a skull-cave ornament, and a pile of river rocks, which appear to be her comfort zone (she'll race down, wriggle between them and sit completely motionless to where sometimes I can't see her!), as well as a couple of medium sized shells. I tried to set it up so that most of the hidey-holes were too tight of a fit for him to fit his fins in after her.

I did float her, the first time in a plastic container (as recommended on a different site) for a day; the second in a large pickle jar, for a couple of hours less than 2 days.

This male is the only one of my fish who lives completely isolated, as he harasses everyone even through the glass. My other bettas all live on the same shelf, across from my community tank (which needs to be either up-sized or thinned out pretty soon) because it's a good fish spot, IMHO.

I know that it's normal for one or both bettas to end up battered at the end, but what happens if I wake up and she's dead?! I worry about that... I don't like dead fish, and I am fond of all of my swimmery things. How likely do you think it is that this is possible? Do you think I should try again?

Is there a possibility that it's the particular pairing, or would he be just as nasty with another -maybe more snarky- female?

I'm really looking for an experienced (not necessarily expert) opinion on this.
One can read everything one can get one's hands on, but in all honesty, there's nothing like first hand accounts and experience.
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Old 11-28-2012, 02:11 AM   #5 
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First off I have to say I've never had eggs hatch, but ive had successful spawn attempts (all the males I've tried so far either eat eggs or let their nests fall apart)
Anyways--you should use a female that has comparable aggressiveness to his but not more than him. I have a male that I have tried to breed 5 times, the first 4 failed because they we're too submissive. The last one finally "worked" because she would flare right back at him. (maybe there is another reason, but that's my opinion)

You could always let the female loose while you are home and cup her again when you leave or go back to bed? I've never tried it though, I always leave the girls in till I see a spawn, over aggressiveness, or it's been 3 days.
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Old 11-28-2012, 07:11 AM   #6 
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I usually do this when i am afraid of losing fish.
Check the male's aggressiveness.If the male keeps on chasing the female i will jar her,or if she feels really frightned(horizontal stripes/breathing rapidly).
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Old 11-28-2012, 09:01 AM   #7 
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Method 1
1. Make female aggressive - as aggressive as you can. Flare her regularly during the conditioning period for about 5-15 minutes. If possible to a female with similar colors to male. IME, aggressive females breeds faster.
2. Make sure she is in "breeding mode" so when you float her, she flirts.
3. Float her on Thursday/Friday so you can hawkeye the pair during the week end. If possible use lamp chimney or something with holes so each could sense the other.
4. Before mid day (80% of mine spawn in the morning) hawkeye your female. If she is less active, head down (totally submissive) - release her. . . . she should almost immediately spawn. If the male is too aggressive, it may take longer.
.................................
Method 2 (never had to try this)
1. Put male in breeding tank.
2. Float a few females each in plastic bags (so male doesn't hurt himself). Any female will do.
3. After a day or 2, float the female you want to breed with other females.
4. When he calms down (it may take 1-3 days or longer, depending on individual male), remove other females with an hour interval.
5. Hawkeye your female's behavior, if totally submissive, release.

.....................................

Every male is different. in fact they will also behave differently during each spawn. So it's hard to say why your male acts the way he does. Yes, no one likes dead females, not even the male. Lol Its always better to be safe. You have done all you can with hide outs. There's nothing more you can do. If this male is too aggressive (after the above methods), perhaps you may want to use a different male.

Good luck, hope the above works for you.
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Old 12-01-2012, 10:58 PM   #8 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indjo View Post
Method 1
1. Make female aggressive - as aggressive as you can. Flare her regularly during the conditioning period for about 5-15 minutes. If possible to a female with similar colors to male. IME, aggressive females breeds faster.
2. Make sure she is in "breeding mode" so when you float her, she flirts.
3. Float her on Thursday/Friday so you can hawkeye the pair during the week end. If possible use lamp chimney or something with holes so each could sense the other.
4. Before mid day (80% of mine spawn in the morning) hawkeye your female. If she is less active, head down (totally submissive) - release her. . . . she should almost immediately spawn. If the male is too aggressive, it may take longer.

Every male is different. If this male is too aggressive (after the above methods), perhaps you may want to use a different male.
I had no idea that you could make the females more aggressive... It never even occurred to me. Like I said, she's always acted like she's ready. In fact, the first time I dumped her in, she saw the male and his nest and immediately did the head down thing. So, I just set her next to the female next door for a bit each day, huh?
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:47 AM   #9 
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Yes.
There are a number of ways to make bettas more aggressive.
Eg. keeping them in total darkness in solitary - only taken out for their morning sunbath.
Flaring to mirror or other bettas.
Flicking their caudal with a long toothpick sized stick.
Plus extreme methods which I won't discuss.

Keep in mind that the most basic key to getting them aggressive and wanting to breed is good health.
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