Genetically speaking, is there a difference between teal and green? Ie: Is teal just green with a blue tint or wash? Or are teal and green the same thing?
If you remember back to color mixing basics, green is made by blue/yellow. So I would think it could be affected as well.
Cal was a teal, light blue veiltail.
Little Blue was the only one that has shown signs of the gray before the rot. I did spawn a yellow to a blue, and she came down with the rot. She was totally unrelated to the blue male. My PK show male now has it. I am sending all my adult fish to a Lab for diagnosis. I have 8 fry from the Royal/Yellow spawn, and 7 from the Royal PK spawn. As soon as I can get them send, and get results back, I'll post what was found in MY fish.
I got my diagnosis today. It IS Mycobacterium! This is what is considered fish TB (but from the Lab Manager....it is NOT TB!!!!!!!) Which verity is unknown because it would have cost me 3x as much as I'm gonna have to pay (which that is still unknown). The rot is a secondary infection...the fish is dying so the fins go first. Cleaning instructions Per the Lab.... scrub/scrap any scum/mineral build up off the tank, heavy bleach solution for AT LEAST a couple of hours...decor...if you can't bleach it...throw it away. Rinse well and spray with rubbing Alcohol (70% iso....). Let dry and set for a couple days.
There is NO cure for this...no medications help...the fish will eventually die from this crap being in internal organs.
This is also more common in the hobby then most people want to admit.
Lori - I'm sorry for your losses. Thank you for investigating this, and for letting us know the results.
Do you think you'll be able to save the rest of your fish? Is it easily transmissible among fish? Did the lab state whether this variety of Mycobacterium can be transmitted to people or other pets?
Again, thank you for investigating this and letting everyone know the outcome. I hope you're able to save your remaining fish.
Lori - I'm sorry for your losses. Thank you for investigating this, and for letting us know the results.
Do you think you'll be able to save the rest of your fish? Is it easily transmissible among fish? Did the lab state whether this variety of Mycobacterium can be transmitted to people or other pets?
Again, thank you for investigating this and letting everyone know the outcome. I hope you're able to save your remaining fish.
Great questions!!! Non transmitted to mammals!!! Well...it can be, but it is more hands, and can be cleared up with antibiotics...I don't use my hands if I have an open wound...I use gloves.
Highly contagious between fish!!! I do not know which of the 4(?) strands it is because it is 3x as much to culture it...and I still don't know how much THIS is going to cost. lol...I may need to ask for donations ;).
ALL my Betta and my 75g, and my 5g killi tank have been exposed through fish/plants. My new OB Peacock chiclid has been exposed through fish (cull babies) and plants. Plant tank has been exposed through spawning.
There is no cure. I will be destroying all the juvies that I have growing out, nuking my fish room (going to use http://www.valleyvet.com/ct_reviews_...#CBFSuperQuail instead of bleach), and I'm going to start from scratch with total new stock.
My new wilds have been exposed through tanks and plants. The only ones safe are the 55g at work, my 10g peacock endler tank, and (about 80% sure) my 10g RCS tank (may have been exposed through plants)....IF I got this from the original breeding stock. It could have come from live foods. It could also have come from my faucets themselves. There is no telling WHERE it came from.
Below is some information from an article that I found informative.
Note especially the information regarding disinfection protocols: bleach alone is not effective.
"Mycobacterial diseases of fish are common, particularly in intensive aquaculture systems and display aquaria. These diseases are collectively referred to as “atypical mycobacteriosis” or simply “mycobacteriosis.”...
Mycobacterium causes a chronic disease, usually characterized by wasting. It should be suspected when fish are in poor condition and also have scale loss, skin ulcers, or a history of reproductive problems. Occasionally, deep hemorrhagic skin lesions will be seen in addition to the more common superficial lesions. Because the disease can masquerade as a number of other conditions.....
Mycobacteriosis is typically a chronic and progressive disease and should be suspected when there is weight loss or loss of condition, especially when accompanied by scale loss, ulcers, or non-specific hemorrhagic lesions (Fig. 3). A “dropsy-like” presentation characterized by extreme abdominal distention, fluid accumulation, and scale protrusion has been reported in zebrafish infected with M. fortuitum. There may also be a history of ineffective use of antibiotics if fish are mycobacterium-positive. Occasionally, exophthalmia will be observed in infected fish. The disease, however, can manifest itself in many different ways so there is no typical presentation.....
Mycobacterial infections of all fish should be considered non-treatable. Although there are some research reports of aquarium fish responding to antibiotic therapy, individual fish have not been cured of the disease. Symptoms may resolve temporarily but often reappear when antibiotics are discontinued.....
Disinfection protocols...
The system should be thoroughly cleaned and bleached, following usual protocols, to remove organic material and biofilm that may harbor organisms. Afterward, all surfaces in the system should be disinfected with a mycobacteriocide....
Mycobacterial organisms are more resistant to disinfection protocols than most bacteria encountered in aquaculture settings. A waxy coating in the cell wall of mycobacteria gives them extra protection from many common disinfectants, including bleach. Effective mycobacteriocidal agents include LysolŽ (1% benzyl-4-chlorophenol-2-phenylphenol), sodium chlorite, and ethyl alcohol at 50 or 70 percent concentrations, but not 30 percent (which requires at least 10 minutes of contact time). Chlorine bleach (sodium hypochlorite), even at concentrations as high as 50,000 mg/L, is only moderately effective in reducing the number of mycobacterial agents in the environment. RoccalŽ and VirkonŽ-S are ineffective."
Last edited by LittleBlueFishlets; 12-14-2012 at 12:43 PM.
I can't believe we have a cause after all this time.
Culling all of those fish cannot be easy, I'm sorry you have to do it. But this gives a lot of people answers, finally. We all owe you for the time and expense you've put into this, Lori.
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