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Old 01-05-2013, 07:12 AM   #1 
Shepaski
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Very sudden case of Dropsy?

I'm just about beginning to fix up my tank and settle the mess I am currently in after my Half headed betta issue posted not long ago. With her now gone for i decided to put her down because i am not confident i can save her, i gave my last remaining female away to a friend of mine who had space to take in a fish.
she's a beginner and did quite well with the last betta i adopted off to her until she passed feeding duty to her mom, causing the fish to be over fed and somehow he died of dropsy. thats was months ago

so just yesterday i dropped My female betta off at her place, she was perfectly healthy when she was with me, eating well though the only problem with me was that she had a male chasing her around.
I added her to my friends tank straight away since the water in the carrier i placed her in was not exposed to the AC for too long in the train

just today my friend tagged me in a photo of the female i gave her..and she was showing clear signs of having Dropsy, Bloated and scales jutting out.
is it possible for a fish to reach this stage in 1 night? I'm trying to figure this out, if it is not possible, then i will defiantly know why that betta i passed to my friend has the illness. i have speculations and i do understand this is probably my fault.
i know dropsy is not really treatable, but help for this case is appreciated, as well as to possible reasons as to how the fish got the illness.


this is information about my Friends tank.
Housing
What size is your tank? 5 gallons
What temperature is your tank? around 80+ F, room temp water here is 84.4F
Does your tank have a filter? Yes, air pump filter
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? most probably.she uses an air pump filter
Is your tank heated? No, we live in a tropical country and her tank is in the living room with no AC, so the temp of the water is 84.4F as that is temp of room temp water
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? Only one guppy, she use to live in my tank with 1 male betta and 8 other fish

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish?Last i check yesterday it was fish food specially for bettas
How often do you feed your betta fish? she feeds them once a day

Maintenance
How often do you perform a water change? weekly water change
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 40%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? water conditioner

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? never tested before


Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? when she was with me yesterday, she was fine and eating well. now she bloated with jutting scales
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? not much at all when she was with me, friend said Fish swam around her tank after i left but mostly stayed at the bottom though.
When did you start noticing the symptoms? Was just noted this afternoon
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how?Never treated fish with Dropsy before, but i have told her to transfer the female to another tank.
Does your fish have any history of being ill? no
How old is your fish (approximately)? roughly a year or 2
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Old 01-05-2013, 01:44 PM   #2 
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Dropsy is usually caused by poor water quality - sometimes fish stress as adrenals get overloaded.

You definitely can't just pop a fish into new water like that. Careful acclimation is always important. She may have been shocked and there may be bacteria in the water that the other fish are ok with but her immune system has not seen that bacteria and her immune system may also be compromised for other reasons.

To treat you will need epsom salts - pure 100% magnesium sulfate with no additives. They will need to be predissolved at a rate of 1 tsp per gallon and then poured into the tank slowly over an hour because it will reduce ph. ES is like AQ in that it never leaves the tank unless you do a water change so you only need to redose along with water changes. She'll need to be in them at least 2 weeks. I would also be looking for an internal antibotic like Kanaplex (#1 choice) maraycn plus or furan 2 (can also be used with kanaplex). Stable clean water is crucial. What size qt is she in?

What does her poop look like?
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:00 PM   #3 
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Isn't Dropsy incurable? i heard some place that it was.

i'll have a look at the shop today to see if we have any of those.

she's contained in a pretty large fish bowl at the moment.
hasn't pooped at all so i can't really say.

for the Qt tank, i'm not sure how we're gonna keep the water clean though i kinda know how to change the water without shock (was linked to a thread here some time ago.)

she's at a stage where she's not eating anymore, though my friend has just updated me saying she swimming around more in the qt bowl as compared to yesterday where she was just laying on the bottom of the tank.. what are her chances at this rate?

Last edited by Shepaski; 01-05-2013 at 09:10 PM.
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Old 01-05-2013, 10:12 PM   #4 
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Dropsy can be very fast moving so timing is important. Waiting several days to treat decreases her chance dramatically and exponentially.

Dropsy is one of the more lethal conditions (actually a symptom of several illnesses) but it can be cured if you treat it fast enough and accurately.

What size is the QT? Bowls are generally 1/2-2 gallons. It's important to be able to determine exactly how much water you have in it for treatment. Guessing is not good. You can measure it out in gallon water jugs from the store or something like that. I'd do 50% water change along with any redosing of meds (48-24 hours see the med instructions for how often) along with 100% weekly change.

You may already know this, but this is how I suggest doing large water changes:

Quote:
To do a water change, use a little cup like a plastic solo cup - this cup must be only for him and have never been used with soap or other chems. Scoop him up in this cup (keep him in the cup about 1/4 full of water - it doesn't need to be much because he won't be in it for long) and leave him in the cup while you change his water. To do the 50% use a turkey baster - dedicated only to him that has never seen soap or chems - and drag it through the gravel and try to suck as much of the poop out as possible, in addition to 50% of the water. Use a thermometer under the running tap to get it to be the same temp as the water that is normally in his tank. When the thermometer says the flowing tap is the right temp, fill back up his tank. At this point, add the conditioner (dose for how much water you change - if you change half the water you add half gallon worth of conditioner, If you do a 100% water change dose for the full gallon change). Float his plastic cup with him in it in the new water. Slowly add a couple tablespoons of the new water into his cup every 10 minutes for at least an hour. Finally, dump him in gently but try to get as little of the old cup water back into the tank as possible. When you do the weekly 100% you will do mostly the same thing except empty his tank fully and rinse everything in it very well under warm water but never use soaps or chemicals. Once it's fully cleaned/rinsed you can refill it and repeat the cup/acclimate phase.

Last edited by callistra; 01-05-2013 at 10:15 PM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:45 AM   #5 
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Okay, will try treatment
they don;t have the exact names of meds you mentioned, but i found a bottle for internal bacteria at the shop and purchased the salt

so just weekly water changes then
The bowl can hold roughly 2.5 litres of water. is that too small? cus its under a gal and we don't really have anything bigger. do we need to get a filter for it for this case?

Last edited by Shepaski; 01-06-2013 at 03:53 AM.
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Old 01-06-2013, 08:19 AM   #6 
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Epsom salt is really good on dropsy. I would use instead of Kanaplex Maracyn II or Maracyn plus in water and Metronidazole in food. Dropsy can be caused by a bacterial infection (gram negative) or by parasites or by unknown causes. So Metronidazole is also good approach. I hope your fish is still eating. It is said that Kanaplex is very hard on kidneys, which is the last thing you would need as dropsy may involve renal failure. If your fish doesn't eat, put the Metro also in the water, combined with Maracyn II or Maracyn Plus. Hope your fish will be ok. It is important to treat it with antibiotics as soon as possible.
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Old 01-06-2013, 12:40 PM   #7 
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i added the antibiotics today, she's not eating at the moment D:

Whats Metro?

at the moment because i'm slightly short on funds i purchased the cheapest aquarium salt at the shop that had the word "good for fish on medication". not sure if it will pass, if not then i'll just get the $8 bottle of epsom salt then.. i'm not sure if we have any of the other things you mentioned. i only know we have epsom salt, but theres nothing else on the packaging that mentions pure 100% magnesium sulfate with no additives.
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Old 01-06-2013, 03:22 PM   #8 
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Sharks maracyn ii has no chance of working and maracyn is erythromycin which is in the same class as kanaplex
But works slower and isn't as broad range or as effective

Metro is harder on fish than kanaplex actually

Aquarium salt will not help and may make things worse.. You need epsoms to treat dropsy. Also exactly what med did you buy? There are
Few which are effective internally despite their advertising
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:02 PM   #9 
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this was the only thing i could find at the shop that mentioned internal bacteria. they didn't have the stuff you mentioned besides epson salt (med section was pretty small). i'll have to search the other shop near by but they were closed on the day i went to purchase this.
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:31 PM   #10 
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What does it say the ingredients are? I've never seen that before and google didn't turn up much.
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