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Old 04-03-2013, 11:11 AM   #31 
Dwarden3
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Originally Posted by Fenghuang View Post
If I'm understanding you correctly, what you want has been done before. A rosetail/feathertails is a halfmoon with extreme branchings, so it'll just be a rosetail/feathertail HMxCT, or a combtail. I think even if you go ahead and do it, you won't see much of the results. Rosetails/feathertails are prone to blowing out their fins from swimming and flaring as well as tail biting and simply ripping them on things. And the heavy fins limit their quality of life.

Also, have you seen x-factor scaling? It's a mess. You're pretty much guaranteed to get that breeding rosetail/feathertails.
So then what is wanted on the breeding circuit? I want to take something desirable and enhance its traits. I was just thinking a rosetailxct would be interesting, but I am open to a anything.
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:45 AM   #32 
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like fenghuang said...it's really nothing new at all, most have been tried before. And all those "combo" only resulted in "intermediate" forms like combtails, halfsuns, even veiltails or roundtails with extended rays, which in the end need to be "improve" or cross back to CT. But since u seem eager to try it, then please do so, who knows if u can actually "create" new form :), although I think the early result will probably "contradict" your point on your first post.
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Old 04-03-2013, 11:50 AM   #33 
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Originally Posted by Dwarden3 View Post
So then what is wanted on the breeding circuit? I want to take something desirable and enhance its traits. I was just thinking a rosetailxct would be interesting, but I am open to a anything.
um, what do you mean exactly with "wanted on the breeding circuit"? if u mean "ideal" form for show..then it's up to some standards of "ideal crowntail" like for example IBC standards for crowntails. But if u mean what most people want to breed, then it will be different for each person, as some goes for colors, some for finnages, and this can change later on too.
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Old 04-03-2013, 12:02 PM   #34 
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um, what do you mean exactly with "wanted on the breeding circuit"? if u mean "ideal" form for show..then it's up to some standards of "ideal crowntail" like for example IBC standards for crowntails. But if u mean what most people want to breed, then it will be different for each person, as some goes for colors, some for finnages, and this can change later on too.
I just want to know what strains are wanted? which strains are new and hip? etc. I like to innovate and mix odd genes, but at the end of the day if my odd mixes wont work/are useless, then I'd much rather take a strain like a HM and perfect its fins and colour.
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Old 04-03-2013, 12:33 PM   #35 
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Old 04-03-2013, 01:19 PM   #36 
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well..like shaina said...ctpk is probably..the latest fin type available and widely accepted..and there's "variation" like Elephant Ears/ Dumbo or "forgotten" line like DTCT ( I don't see many of them anymore, in fact..never..lately ).
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Old 04-03-2013, 03:44 PM   #37 
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Why did you make the same thread in different sections?

As implied, any fin type (non CT) can be crossed to CT. F1 will yield uneven web reduction - messy fins. You will have to work yourself to make them actual CT.

Rose tail is a result from breeding excessive ray male to excessive ray female - 8 ray male x 8 ray female. They will often bring out deformities, specially if you inbreed them. It is best to breed "in and out" - create rose, then breed to less ray. NEVER breed rose to rose.

So if you want to try roseCT you have to create good CT then introduce Rose. DO NOT introduce rose in the beginning of your quest since you will need to inbreed. . . . unless you have 20 - 50 unrelated bettas to choose from.

It is best to create your own rose instead of buying them. That way you'd know if they carry deformities in which case you'd best cull every single one of them (including the healthy ones because they are carriers). It is possible to breed out deformities in roses (not sure how though). We have a few here (forgot who). Never the less, I still believe it's best not to inbreed them nor to breed to another excessive ray.
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Old 04-03-2013, 04:05 PM   #38 
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Originally Posted by indjo View Post
Why did you make the same thread in different sections?

As implied, any fin type (non CT) can be crossed to CT. F1 will yield uneven web reduction - messy fins. You will have to work yourself to make them actual CT.

Rose tail is a result from breeding excessive ray male to excessive ray female - 8 ray male x 8 ray female. They will often bring out deformities, specially if you inbreed them. It is best to breed "in and out" - create rose, then breed to less ray. NEVER breed rose to rose.

So if you want to try roseCT you have to create good CT then introduce Rose. DO NOT introduce rose in the beginning of your quest since you will need to inbreed. . . . unless you have 20 - 50 unrelated bettas to choose from.

It is best to create your own rose instead of buying them. That way you'd know if they carry deformities in which case you'd best cull every single one of them (including the healthy ones because they are carriers). It is possible to breed out deformities in roses (not sure how though). We have a few here (forgot who). Never the less, I still believe it's best not to inbreed them nor to breed to another excessive ray.
So would it be possible to make a nice CT, HM, or CTHM line, then introduce the rosetail and then only breed with your strain until you get the Desired trait? Would it be possible to make a very short rosetail but it also has very long rays? Like a CT, but with the first 1/3 of the being like that of a rosetail. I am just throwing around idea. I would like to do something like that if it would make an interesting specimen. If such cross breeding would make undesirable/worthless fry then I would rather just spend my time perfecting a CT or HM line.

I posted twice because I saw that one thread group had a lot more activity than the other.
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Old 04-04-2013, 02:01 AM   #39 
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There is nothing definite in regards to betta keeping. There are always new mutations, new methods, etc. So what your suggesting is possible. But it will take you many generations - thousands of bettas. . . . unless of course you are very lucky and achieve the first step in one or two generations.

Like I said, I'm not a fan of CT thus have very limited experience with them and never experimented on them. You would have to ask cassaicrowntail who specializes in CT. Theoretically it is possible but I don't know how to go about it.

Whether it would be worth the effort depends on you. No one knew how people would accept CT. They just worked on something new and kept developing it. And now CT are accepted by many. SO I can't answer this question. It's up to you.

For future postings;
This section is supposed to be dedicated for show - show quality, show developing/improving, etc. I will answer the same question differently in this section and in the breeding section. So in the future, I'd appreciate it if you asked experimental questions in the breeding section. Only ask show related questions here.
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Old 04-04-2013, 02:28 AM   #40 
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Originally Posted by indjo View Post
There is nothing definite in regards to betta keeping. There are always new mutations, new methods, etc. So what your suggesting is possible. But it will take you many generations - thousands of bettas. . . . unless of course you are very lucky and achieve the first step in one or two generations.

Like I said, I'm not a fan of CT thus have very limited experience with them and never experimented on them. You would have to ask cassaicrowntail who specializes in CT. Theoretically it is possible but I don't know how to go about it.

Whether it would be worth the effort depends on you. No one knew how people would accept CT. They just worked on something new and kept developing it. And now CT are accepted by many. SO I can't answer this question. It's up to you."

For future postings;
This section is supposed to be dedicated for show - show quality, show developing/improving, etc. I will answer the same question differently in this section and in the breeding section. So in the future, I'd appreciate it if you asked experimental questions in the breeding section. Only ask show related questions here.

Is it possible to "merge" post, Indjo? and like Indjo said..I also think that there are a lot of "unknown" traits/colors waiting to be discover, but..like I said before..u were saying "I know he probably isn't, but I just want to start getting an idea of what is good in a breeding fish before I end up with hundreds of poorly bred fry." "experimenting" to get "new traits/colors" will result in..perhaps thousands of "undesirable" individuals ( in show standard term ).
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