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Old 04-26-2013, 01:00 PM   #81 
xShainax
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Crabby, how DARE you say we are related to monkeys. The FSM said we are related to meatballs. xD Sorry my attempt at humor with all of the evolution deniers.
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Old 04-26-2013, 03:03 PM   #82 
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Sorry, but I have to agree on this one. What you said wasn't a matter of your opinion, rather it was an unfair and not nice assumption you made about everyone that wasn't completely against it like you are. There's no room for interpretation, you said it plain and clear.
"You have obviously never owned and loved a dog if you think it is ok in any way."

It's just really not nice to get into the "if you don't agree with me, you're a hater" kind of attitude.

I, for one, have made it clear that I would not personally eat a dog... but I do understand the cultural difference in why some don't see it as wrong there.

But I DO have a dog, and only 2 years out of my 26 have I been without one. But I think it is ok in a way. Let's all just stick to opinions and facts, and NOT make assumptions (particularly unfriendly ones) about the people we are debating with, or stereotyping anyone. That way we keep this more friendly.

But if this thread is disturbing you so, I do suggest you take yourself out of it (not in a rude way, but because there are things that bother me as well that I have come to understand that just aren't worth putting myself through stress discussing the topic... so for your own good so you don't get too upset)...

Heck, I WISH I could be a vegetarean too! I tried once... but I just don't have the will power to not eat meat

I do try every year to grow my own vegetables too. Let's put it this way... I do NOT have a green thumb My tomatoes are always awesome, and my radishes are ok.... but my carrots last year had awesome leaves above ground, and below were only 1" long. GRRRRR, lol

Oh, and I found out that cabbage is really resilient! It actually THRIVED in the snow this winter! haha

Olympia, you bring up a valid point about the balance of nature. To get 20 cattle, you just need to feed them grass. But to get 20 dogs, you have to feed them loads of other creatures as dogs are carnivores. So farming carnivores for food really makes a bigger dent on the animal kingdom than farming herbivores. I hope I'm making sense?

I think you are the first person to provide a good argument not based on opinion or sentiment, but rather one that makes sense as far as it's physical effects. You just turned it up a notch! hehehe
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Old 04-26-2013, 03:06 PM   #83 
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Originally Posted by JadeAngel View Post
Sorry, but I have to agree on this one. What you said wasn't a matter of your opinion, rather it was an unfair and not nice assumption you made about everyone that wasn't completely against it like you are. There's no room for interpretation, you said it plain and clear.
"You have obviously never owned and loved a dog if you think it is ok in any way."

It's just really not nice to get into the "if you don't agree with me, you're a hater" kind of attitude.
Amen.
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Old 04-26-2013, 04:07 PM   #84 
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Related to meatballs... now that's funny!!!
My only issue is with the inhumane treatment by that portion of the meat industry. If you want organic, free range etc, you have to buy and cook yourself. (Frank Perdue does resemble a chicken)
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Old 04-27-2013, 08:44 PM   #85 
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I would say that the stuff they eat is china is uhhh, of a wide variety. Dog meat, cat meat, snake etc etc. I do not have any problem with them eating these things, i do not want to try it myself but it doesnt bug me that they eat them. The problem is not actually with the eating of the meat.

I am saying this because i have experienced this first hand so i am not stereotyping or making up stories.(in case you think i am) The issue is how some of the people there get the dog meat. My dad has a factory in China and we have quite a few dogs in the compound and sometimes they get outside to just roam around. There was once, one of our dogs got out and was crossing the street and some car just rammed our dog. They then stopped the car, got out, picked up our dog, stuffed it in the back and drove off with it. It was then the guard for the factory told us what happened. He explained that it happens all the time all over China, they run over dogs and just take them home to cook.

Its just terrible, we've kept all our dogs within the compound since then, never left them out.
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Old 04-28-2013, 12:25 AM   #86 
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I do not doubt that it happens sometimes. It's like people hitting wild deer on the road in the US and then taking it home to butcher it. (Though most people don't intentionally run down large animals that could put a massive dent in their car...)

I do think the guard saying that it happens "all over China" may be a bit of an exaggeration though. Considering how big of a problem the feral dog population is over there, running down someone's pet would be pretty drastic...and desperate. Also, cars are expensive in China. If they have enough money for one, wouldn't they have enough money to not have to go prowl the streets to pick stray dogs off? After all, a lot of cities have taken to mass poisoning campaigns to control the out of control feral population and it would be really risky and unsafe... Not that I know anything about it. First time I've heard of that.

But I agree absolutely. That is horribly cruel and I would never support people who do that.

Last edited by Fenghuang; 04-28-2013 at 12:30 AM.
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Old 04-28-2013, 12:56 AM   #87 
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I am vegan and would never eat any animal but I must say that I do not see the difference between eating a dog and a cow, lamb, pig or whatever. They are all living breathing beings it is only humans who decide that dogs are pets and cows, pigs etc are food. Humans tend to eat vegetarian animals that wouldn't hurt anyone but cringe away from the thought of eating a carnivore that in the right situation may try to eat a human. That never made sense to me. Anyway do not get me wrong I love all animals and am completely against the killing of any life however this is an interesting point that I thought I would make..... just something to think about.
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Old 04-28-2013, 01:37 AM   #88 
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Originally Posted by veggiegirl View Post
I am vegan and would never eat any animal but I must say that I do not see the difference between eating a dog and a cow, lamb, pig or whatever. They are all living breathing beings it is only humans who decide that dogs are pets and cows, pigs etc are food. Humans tend to eat vegetarian animals that wouldn't hurt anyone but cringe away from the thought of eating a carnivore that in the right situation may try to eat a human. That never made sense to me. Anyway do not get me wrong I love all animals and am completely against the killing of any life however this is an interesting point that I thought I would make..... just something to think about.
I see what you mean, but that's more of a sentiment based logic that would fail in practise.

Humans (and every omnivore and carnivore in existence) tend to go for herbivores first for a few reasons. It is how nature intended it. Millions upon millions of years of evolution have lead to omnivores and carnivores focusing on herbivores for lunch.

Firstly would be natural programming. I mean, we've evolved into a "civilized" species, but we still have basic instincts. The most basic of which says "don't play with food that bites back" lol.

Also, and most important, if you follow your logic, you would actually have us kill MORE animals in order to consume 1 animal. Let's say we take a cow... you get more than 500 lbs of meat off of 1 single steer. To feed that cow meant long hours in the fields, but it was only hay and grain that you had to give it.

Now let's go to a larger carnivore. Well... let's cross evey one off the list that really wouldn't be farmable. Well.... I'm pretty sure lions, tigers, and bears are out... oh my! couldn't resist. But seriously, who's going to give up their cattle farm to try their hand at lion rangling?

Let's go down a size and go after wolves. Well... they're a little more manageable... (we're going to say wolves instead of general dogs, as wolves are larger) they're about 150-200 lbs... so you'll get about 70 lbs of meat (using deer as a guide for that, as I grew up with all my friends hunting) and to get that 70 lbs of meat, you had to feed that 1 wolf how many animals until it was ready to be taken for the meat? You'll have to kill 7 wolves to get the same meat of that 1 cow, and ontop of that you need to kill 15 deer to get each wolf... since they don't eat grass.

So to get 500 lbs of hervibore, you need to kill only 1 animal.
to get 500 lbs of carnivore, you need to kill 105 animals.

Of course, that's only going with the larger of the 2 that are semi-manageable. There really aren't many carnivores that we'd be able to control in larger popualations enough to farm them. And mother nature plans things quite well as far as reproduction, adaptation, and size.

I do envy those that have the self control to become vegetarians and vegans, but I don't think anyone who can't or won't are any better or worse than those that can
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Old 04-28-2013, 01:37 AM   #89 
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Originally Posted by veggiegirl View Post
I am vegan and would never eat any animal but I must say that I do not see the difference between eating a dog and a cow, lamb, pig or whatever.
This is the same way I am, except the vegan part.
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Old 04-28-2013, 02:31 AM   #90 
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Originally Posted by JadeAngel View Post
I see what you mean, but that's more of a sentiment based logic that would fail in practise.

Humans (and every omnivore and carnivore in existence) tend to go for herbivores first for a few reasons. It is how nature intended it. Millions upon millions of years of evolution have lead to omnivores and carnivores focusing on herbivores for lunch.

Firstly would be natural programming. I mean, we've evolved into a "civilized" species, but we still have basic instincts. The most basic of which says "don't play with food that bites back" lol.

Also, and most important, if you follow your logic, you would actually have us kill MORE animals in order to consume 1 animal. Let's say we take a cow... you get more than 500 lbs of meat off of 1 single steer. To feed that cow meant long hours in the fields, but it was only hay and grain that you had to give it.

Now let's go to a larger carnivore. Well... let's cross evey one off the list that really wouldn't be farmable. Well.... I'm pretty sure lions, tigers, and bears are out... oh my! couldn't resist. But seriously, who's going to give up their cattle farm to try their hand at lion rangling?

Let's go down a size and go after wolves. Well... they're a little more manageable... (we're going to say wolves instead of general dogs, as wolves are larger) they're about 150-200 lbs... so you'll get about 70 lbs of meat (using deer as a guide for that, as I grew up with all my friends hunting) and to get that 70 lbs of meat, you had to feed that 1 wolf how many animals until it was ready to be taken for the meat? You'll have to kill 7 wolves to get the same meat of that 1 cow, and ontop of that you need to kill 15 deer to get each wolf... since they don't eat grass.

So to get 500 lbs of hervibore, you need to kill only 1 animal.
to get 500 lbs of carnivore, you need to kill 105 animals.

Of course, that's only going with the larger of the 2 that are semi-manageable. There really aren't many carnivores that we'd be able to control in larger popualations enough to farm them. And mother nature plans things quite well as far as reproduction, adaptation, and size.

I do envy those that have the self control to become vegetarians and vegans, but I don't think anyone who can't or won't are any better or worse than those that can
dude. mind freaking blown.
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