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Old 08-20-2013, 11:42 PM   #21 
Noctiluca
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I want one! I would say both but I only have one spare tank at the moment.

Seki I sent you a message ^-^
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:14 AM   #22 
indjo
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Regardless of novice or expert, it takes at least 3 (usually more) generations to fix new traits into a betta.

To my knowledge, metallic and dragon scales are related . . . sort of. It's easier to create DS by crossing it to metallics but you don't need them to create DS. I read somewhere that metallics only need one metallic gene while DS need a pair of them. But either crossing (DS x regular or DS x metallic) will produce partial DS.

If you crossed a DSVT to a regular DSHM/DSPK, you need to choose the DS with long fins (preferably a VT female). Then breed back to the DS parent to strengthen DS genes. Then inbreed to make DSVT. . . . adding new traits to VT is easier than adding it to HM. VT are quite dominant. . . .
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Old 08-21-2013, 01:18 AM   #23 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by indjo View Post
Regardless of novice or expert, it takes at least 3 (usually more) generations to fix new traits into a betta.

To my knowledge, metallic and dragon scales are related . . . sort of. It's easier to create DS by crossing it to metallics but you don't need them to create DS. I read somewhere that metallics only need one metallic gene while DS need a pair of them. But either crossing (DS x regular or DS x metallic) will produce partial DS.

If you crossed a DSVT to a regular DSHM/DSPK, you need to choose the DS with long fins (preferably a VT female). Then breed back to the DS parent to strengthen DS genes. Then inbreed to make DSVT. . . . adding new traits to VT is easier than adding it to HM. VT are quite dominant. . . .
From my work with chickens, three generations only works if you pick exactly the right stock with exactly the right genotypes. And really, has that ever actually happened?? XD If I were to use my current male with a DS female, I would be amazed to get a full DSVT in the F2 cross. And if 'fixing traits' is betta speak for what 'breeding true' is in chicken speak, I expect it would take significantly longer then three, especially for someone who doesn't fully understand the underlying genes at work.

Really interesting though, the whole metallic / dragonscale deal. Still doing lots of reading. Thanks for laying things out in slightly simpler terms though, really helps with sorting out the slightly less cohesive articles.
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Old 08-21-2013, 01:45 AM   #24 
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We used to only get dragon vts in our petshops lol no other types
you could find a dragon trad pk which should be easier to find. Then cross that to a vt. Since trad pk is just shortfinned vt you wont end up mucking with the rays and shape of the vt form like you would if you add tail types with more branching
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Old 08-21-2013, 03:06 PM   #25 
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Alright, so I picked up the fish Noctiluca wanted! Pictures, anyone? He is currently acclimating to his little QT tank, where he will be until he ships. Sorry, little guy, a half a gallon is gonna be your home for a little while. Apparently I remembered incorrectly about his fins, and he is actually a butterfly, not just solid red fins. He's very pretty, though! And now that I've seen him in better lighting (hate to say it, but the betta cups were stacked on top of each other on this disgusting little stand, so they got ZERO light), his dragonscaling is metallic and shiny~ I also grabbed a couple pictures of the blue DSVT.




And this little guy seemed so sad to be left behind, but Noctiluca said she only has one tank.

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Old 08-21-2013, 03:07 PM   #26 
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Oh my gosh, the red one is gorgeous.
I LOVE the red patterning on his anal fin.
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Old 08-21-2013, 03:17 PM   #27 
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I'm glad you think so! That is Noctiluca's new little boy... I hope he fits the bill! He's absolutely stunning, in my opinion! More pictures in a bit, he's a little stressed right now. Very active and curious, though! ^_^
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:43 PM   #28 
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Took a peek at the thread at work today and saw the pictures you posted, Seki. Now my coworkers think I'm nuts 'cause I did this weird flaily-armed dance in my excitement So glad to hear he's doing well! I'm sure he's enjoying being out of that cup. And I have to say, that has got to be the some of the coolest butterfly patterning I've seen yet.

I really would take them both if I could, they're both gorgeous fish. But if I got another tank at this point I would have to buy another peice of furniture to put it on- and there's nowhere to put that!
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:56 PM   #29 
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Ahhh, I'm so glad you like him!! He's hanging out on his plant at the moment, relaxing a little bit. I'll offer a pellet tonight to see if he'd like some food... he's already settling into this new space well!

More pictures? ^_^

This is the only picture I have of him with flash on. His dragonscaling almost looks a bit greenish to me? It's more silvery-whiteish-blueish (<-- award-winning description) in RL, though.


He's such a chill fish lol. Although he does have moments where he darts around like a madman hahaha.


His eyes are two-tone. And from the front, he has a little bit of dragonscaling on the front of each eye so you can actually see where he's looking! ^_^ Pretty cool fish, really~
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Old 08-21-2013, 10:41 PM   #30 
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You will never hear me complain about more pictures!

He's going to look absolutly fantastic once those fins heal up, honesty right now I'm just doing more of this: <- New fav emoticon

Last edited by Noctiluca; 08-21-2013 at 10:42 PM. Reason: Splelling. Or whatever...
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