Look if oak work's for you, and you like it good for you the more power to ya. I'm going to use what the fish live in and what has been proven to work, and what top breeders use. IAL is what works for me and everyone else. Just like you need a job and want people to spend money at your bosses company so you have a job. It's all about keeping the economy going. Keeping aquatic life is not cheap so I don't no why people are acting like 10.00 every 6 - 10 months is a lot. Just one little bottle of prime is 10.00 or more and IAL is a natural conditioner, as long as you let the water age or don't have chlorine in your water.
Amy and her family get these leaves and sort them wash them and bag them, she has her kids doing it as a responsibility type thing and they work together as a family. If I can throw a little money her way. And help me and the fish. I mean you can get 3 - 4 months worth for what a pack soda cost. You act like people are asking an arm or leg for the leaves. Anyway I hate to hear people cry so if it works for thumbs up, for using what resources you have around you and experimenting before using a specific leaf...
Look if oak work's for you, and you like it good for you the more power to ya. I'm going to use what the fish live in and what has been proven to work, and what top breeders use. IAL is what works for me and everyone else. Just like you need a job and want people to spend money at your bosses company so you have a job. It's all about keeping the economy going. Keeping aquatic life is not cheap so I don't no why people are acting like 10.00 every 6 - 10 months is a lot. Just one little bottle of prime is 10.00 or more and IAL is a natural conditioner, as long as you let the water age or don't have chlorine in your water.
Amy and her family get these leaves and sort them wash them and bag them, she has her kids doing it as a responsibility type thing and they work together as a family. If I can throw a little money her way. And help me and the fish. I mean you can get 3 - 4 months worth for what a pack soda cost. You act like people are asking an arm or leg for the leaves. Anyway I hate to hear people cry so if it works for thumbs up, for using what resources you have around you and experimenting before using a specific leaf...
I agree with you on the price of leaves but if they both work whats the poin of fighting?
You say you're open minded but in most of the posts I've seen it dosen't look like it.
I think you're relying on the IBC and top breeders way to much. Everyone has their way of doing things.
I REALLY don't mean to sound rude and I hope we can all be friends here seeing how we are a community :)
Hey All, Thanks for everyone's interest in the experiment!
Its amazing to see the progress of the chestnut oak leaves as I just added them to the lineup yesterday and have already seen impressive changes...
I also like the way the leaf holds in the water...You can really see the dark tannin color compared to the English oak, with the yellow tannin..
Although the Chinquapin Oak leaves are very hard when dried and do not look like they will crumble, so this could be another reason why it is taking longer for the leaf to release its tannins...Sorry to the Red Oak fans, who are going to have to be patient with the release of tannins lol...be patient! They may have the best results in the end!
As some of you may know, I am heading north this week for a few days to collect some drift wood on a snorkeling/scuba expedition, in Georgian bay Ontario for my 75 gallon sorority tank... i will be documenting the underwater experience taking shots of all things exciting lol!
I will continue with the OAK posts in a few days, sure to be some exciting new results..Also included will be a full scale water test of all jars, showing PH levels, Nitrate Levels, Ammonia, etc...And good tests as well! lol
I am sure you did this...but make sure you have a "control" container of water too, especially for water testing......to see if pH is affected and anything air born that can affect the rest...
Next experiment that would be neat, is adding the same leaf to different jar but tearing them up first to see if that helps/changes in tannin release, speeds decay...etc......just a thought...
Good luck and be careful scuba diving....that sounds like so much fun........
Well heck, I live pretty close to Cheesequake National Park and I know it pretty well. If I need other oaks I bet I can find them there. I don't think there's a law against collecting dead leaves. Still... GO red oak!
Well heck, I live pretty close to Cheesequake National Park and I know it pretty well. If I need other oaks I bet I can find them there. I don't think there's a law against collecting dead leaves. Still... GO red oak!
If your anything like me you'll take a pretty rock if you see it too... LOL.
Also gotta agree with MrVampire, FB you seem very interested in the IBC which is awesome, but gotta remember that every persons betta doesn't have to be perfect. Theres a lot of younger people on this website - not everyone wants 10 dollar imported leaves when theirs plenty in the backyard!! This thread is for OAK leaves, not for you to tell us why you dont see the point in them. Sorry if I sound rude but you must be more considerate of financials, and plain common sense. IAL are cool, but oak works fine!
Last edited by prettylittlefishy; 08-29-2010 at 06:53 PM.
Thought I would show an update of the new arrivals...very interesting color changes, and over night....wow....Chinquapin will definitely start being used in my tanks (as of now)...
Be sure to check out tomorrows update...water testing, more pics, and NEW LEAF (Bur Oak)!
The New Line Up; now includes a Bur Oak, on the far right side..
It is 3 Days behind, but am curious of its results..
I am going out to get a new water testing kit as mine is missing things and want to be thorough. To test the water I will be using separate containers I made, Larger with more leaves but still all containing same amounts of water and # of leaves. The Water Testing; will mainly show ammonia, bu also indicate other levels such as PH etc...Please PM me or post any additional water testing you wish to see done...
Below is a post of the new tannin result jars, containing the new Bur Leafs.. I love the two I added earlier in the post, the Chestnut and Chinquapin...AMAZING colors! And sooo fast to change, (remember they were put in 2 days later and surpassed the colors overnight... Red Oak: WTF? I cant believe the slow release of tannins!?!But as I said I will be conducting a side experiment using leaves of different "dryness" , as I believe the Oak leaves I used in the larger scale test were not fully dried out like the others...As I mentioned I have used them before and was happy with their color outcome in the water.
The test will include 3 jars with different dried leaves (all as dried as I can find) from different RED OAKS, in different areas over 2 hours apart driving distance...
This will hopefully give me wider range of possible outcomes and maybe will show more color...or this is the nature of the Red Oak, slow release...well see...
After a long wait, after many pictures, water tests and color checks, I have finally settled on a preferred leaf!
I have found the water results were very similar, but i will mention some of the interesting things found in the test!
TANNIN-
The color of all water was drastically different. But some leafs stood out over others...The Red oak gave off a yellow tint, the chinquapin gave off a dark red tannin. The white pine gave off a darker yellow tint and the bur oak had an orange hue..The pictures display this more but it was interesting to see how fast the tannin was released as well.. The Chinquapin was the fastest to release the tannin and had over night color change, surpassing all other leaves in the test.
The latest pictures are in the prior posts, there was little difference in color after that point.
White Discretion- This was the only area where there was slight difference in the water. Some leaves gave off a lot of white discharge from the moisture in the leaves. There was almost none from the chinqiapin oak, however all others had this.
Ammonia- All jars had high results of ammonia after testing the waters, but there was little to no difference in the amount from leaf to leaf.
RESULT:
Overall all leaves did give off great tannin. However the release and color of tannin depends on the specific leaf it self. If the leaf is not totally dry, or has any moisture left in it, there will be little tannin released.
Where the leaves are leaft dead opn a tree and then used 100% dry, there is great difference in the tannins in water. Also, I will be trying this experiement again soon using leaves that have changed with fall color. This may also have a drastic effect.
Choice:Chinquapin Oak- (pictured below)
Reasons-
-Great composure. The leaf itself holds composure even months after in water.
-There is also little to no milky discharge the come from the leaf after being exposed to water.
-Instant Color. There is little need to pre-soak these leaves, to obtain fast changes in color and added effects, as they release over night.
- Great color. Even before fall color Change the leaves have great colors.
Other Good choices-
- IMO, I will be using Chinquapin from now on solely, but i also use red if they are extremely dry with some color, and English oak was also great as it kept composure and had a fast tannin result as well. However, both leaves had slight milky discharge (not as much as others) but also didn't have very dark color in water. This however could be achieved by uisng more leaves.
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