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Old 02-03-2013, 09:01 AM   #11 
Kbud
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Nice! Has anyone ever tried the carnivorous plant Bladderwort? BTW, how does your betta like the amazon sword and moss? Considering getting some today.....
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Old 02-03-2013, 11:04 AM   #12 
valen1014
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Originally Posted by Kytkattin View Post
As already mentioned, plants literally eat up (in a way) the toxic stuff found in the water that the betta creates. This makes the plants happy and the fish happy. Plants also do create oxygen, however, this not not benefit betta fish in particular, this would be helpful for fish that do not posses a labyrinth lung.

While beneficial bacteria does play a part in the process of cycling a tank, there are really two ways to cycle a tank, one is with movement of water in order to support a high enough level of beneficial bacteria (BB) that turns ammonia to nitrites and then nitrites to nitrates. Thus rendering the water not toxic to the fish as waste is broken down. The second way is through plants using the ammonia/nitrites in order to grow. So while some BB might be present in the water, it is not the BB that breaks down and detoxifies the ammonia/fish waste, but instead the plants absorbing it and growing from it. Plants also absorb CO2 and create oxygen from it (basically the opposite effect from our breathing). This is crucial for fish that do not breathe from the surface like betta fish do, especially if there is not a filter or other method to oxygenate the water.

For most plants, anything that oxygenates the water, such as a filter, or air stone, and creates movement will make it more difficult for the plant to grow. That is, filters and air stones remove CO2 from the water, which is what the plants need to breathe. While these items are absolutely crucial for keeping some species of fish alive when plants are not present, it will stunt the growth of plants. In order to increase the growth of plants there are two popular options: the first and cheapest/easiest is to use a CO2 replacement. This is often a liquid that is added to a tank on a regular basis. However, some types of mosses (Christmas, java) and algae (such as the Marimo moss ball type) will die or brown when this is added to the tank. The second option, and the one the professional aquascapers often use is to inject CO2 into the tank. This can be costly to set up and maintain, but the reward is plants that can grow inches a day, turn vibrant colors if their species allows (such as red or purple), or even difficult species will grow well. All plants benefit from this, even the aforementioned ones that might die with the presence of a liquid CO2 replacement. There are ways to make your own CO2 system at home for much cheaper than the expensive injection systems that are available as well, but your results may vary.
Well plants kinda need oxygen too for respiration so I wouldn't necessarily say that oxygenation is bad for plants ^^; I was wondering if you know why it would be that water disturbance increases oxygenation of water but causes the CO2 to come out? They are both gases diffused in water, you would think they'd both be affected the same way. Unless it's a concentration issue assuming that there's a build up of CO2 in the water and lack of O2 and so CO2 escapes and O2 enters... and do you know if the DIY CO2 with yeast also affects those plants also (mosses, javas, marimo)
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Old 02-03-2013, 12:52 PM   #13 
blu the betta
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the plants lower the ammonia level.
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Old 02-04-2013, 11:08 AM   #14 
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my plants consists of my entire filtration. I also have a filter on full blast because I like the flow :) But the filter doesnt take any of the bioload at all.

Having plants means a very stable system (as long as you have light!) potentially less water changes (if you have enough plants and is lazy like I am...)
And a pretty green tank.

I've left my fish home alone with the light on a timer for 11 days, came home and everything was still perfect ;)
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Old 02-04-2013, 03:01 PM   #15 
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Well plants kinda need oxygen too for respiration so I wouldn't necessarily say that oxygenation is bad for plants ^^; I was wondering if you know why it would be that water disturbance increases oxygenation of water but causes the CO2 to come out? They are both gases diffused in water, you would think they'd both be affected the same way. Unless it's a concentration issue assuming that there's a build up of CO2 in the water and lack of O2 and so CO2 escapes and O2 enters... and do you know if the DIY CO2 with yeast also affects those plants also (mosses, javas, marimo)
This is my interpretation, please research this all further! Yes, plants absolutely need some oxygen, just like we need some CO2. We can't breathe in pure oxygen (it does stuff to our heads...), and plants can't breathe in pure CO2. However, they actually use CO2, just like we use oxygen. It is the main component that they breathe. When we (and fish) breathe in air, we release CO2. When plants breathe in air, they release oxygen. So how does this tie into the surface agitation being bad for plants? Say you have a fish other than a betta, one that has to breathe from the water, not from the surface like our fish do. Well that fish is naturally breathing out what the plant needs, and the plant is naturally breathing out what the fish needs*. If you add a form of surface agitation then you are removing the extra CO2 that the fish is adding to the water. This is VERY good if you don't have plants, as the CO2 build up could kill a fish. However, in a planted tank it is less beneficial for the plants. How much CO2 do betta fish add? I have no clue. Any notable amount probably comes from their decaying waste/fecal matter, not from their actual respiration. Though it is not to say they don't add some. I don't know a lot about betta respiration other than they have a labyrinth lung.

As for the DIY CO2, it is a form of natural CO2, thus it will not cause the problems to mosses and algae seen with artificial CO2.

*It should be noted that plants only do this during the process of photosynthesis. Some people do provide a form of surface agitation in heavily planted tanks at night, particularily if CO2 injection is involved as that is when CO2 levels can get deadly as the plants are not removing it from the system. Adding any sort of CO2 should not cause this problem in a planted betta tank as they do breathe from the surface. In particular, DIY CO2 is generally considered the safest and one should not worry about overdosing it unless they are adding multiple soda pop containers to one tank under so many gallons.
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Old 02-04-2013, 03:30 PM   #16 
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I'll simplify a bit. lol.
-Plants need light to photosynthesize: convert oxygen to CO2.
-At night when there is no light, plants use oxygen instead and produce CO2 (just like us!)
- CO2 provided via DIY CO2 is the same as CO2 provided via pressurized CO2.
After all CO2 is CO2! that is, two moleules of oxygen bonded with one molecule of Carbon.
-Usually at night, CO2 (non DIY) is switched off.
- Surface agitation promotes an equilibrium. ie. if the water is high in dissolved gases in the water it will release those when the water is agitated,
conversely if the water is low in dissolved gasses, agitating the water will allow more gases to dissolve in the water.
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Old 02-04-2013, 07:07 PM   #17 
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Okay. I get it now. Less water changes is always a plus! Overall, they seem advantageous, but need care just like your fish.
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