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New here and I have a question about my first time spawn

2K views 47 replies 7 participants last post by  Sena Hansler 
#1 ·
Hi, I am new here and have a few questions. I got my bettas to spawn for the first time last night, it was amazing to watch them embrace again and again and when the eggs started falling with the embraces I was even more astounded at how the male caught every single egg before it hit the ground and took it up to the nest. I removed the female when she started to run from him and now I am anxiously awaiting fry... also here is a link to a video of one of the embraces with eggs...

youtu.be/HWNXnGKUtk8

So now it has been 24 hours and from what I have read, I should see some wiggling hair like things in the eggs as the embryo's develop.. but I don't see anything. My betta is still hanging out under the nest but he also swims around the tank occasionally although he always returns to the nest. I am afraid he may have eaten the eggs since this is the first time they spawned.
So when should I start seeing something before I assume that either the eggs were a bad batch or that they have been eaten? I have left the light on 24/7 so that he can always see and care for the eggs.

I bought both of these bettas from a fish store, the male from one fish store and the female from petco or petsmart (cant remember which store). I know sometimes pet store bettas can be retired breeders or young ones. I have had them for 4 months and fed them a varied diet of frozen bloodworms, frozen brine shrimp, and omega one betta pellets. They live in heavily planted 5 gallon aquariums.



Also, here is a thread on another forum where I logged this spawn.
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f82/how-do-you-spawn-your-bettas-183715.html
It was really an accident. Years ago I had bought several bettas and had several 10 gallon tanks and tried without any success to get any two of them to spawn. This time around I just happened to have one male and one female because thats what my kids picked for their tanks. I thought "hmmm, let me put them together and see what happens"... so yeah it was pretty amazing. And my local fish store will buy bettas for 1/3 of the price they can sell them for, but he said they have to be 'pretty big'. And I think the male I have, from what I have researched, is pretty good breeding quality.


Thanks for any info anyone can provide!
 
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#2 · (Edited)
They may not be very noticeable.
If the tank is on the colder side it will takelonger to hatch, if they hatch. What temp do you have the tanks set to?
if he is still guarding/tending the nest there are probably eggs there. If you have a flashlight you can shine it up at the nest and look for eggs or tails.

Also,I love the video. <3 Looks like a CT female and a VT male? You should get plenty of red comb-vailtails from this spawn. Not something normally bred for but your fish are lovely and as long as you have the petshop willing to take any fry to can't rehome everything looks good.
 
#3 ·
The tank is heated and set to 82 degrees and I live in florida and my house is usually around 76
I assume the female is crowntail and yes it is a Vailtale male... I actually find them to be the most beautiful. I know it is not recommended for breeding, but honestly I expected nothing to happen, and it is not something I plan on doing on a regular basis. I know it sounds irresponsible, but I do have the means to take care of the fry and set up appropriate housing for them and I have done my research.

and thank you for your response, I really hope to see fry soon... I imagine betta tanks all over the house... he he he...
 
#5 ·
Haha it really does end up that way if you don't have shelves or something set up for them.
In the new vid it looks like he caught something and spit it back into the nest.

hehe and it's not /bad/ to breed VT's especially when out crossing to something els.People just tend to avoid making combtails because the first generation can tend to look messy. I look up to the people who want to breed better vailtails. you're boy looks lovely and if I found a VT with his body/fins in another color(like platinum white or black orchid) I'd buy him for sure. I passed up a black orchid VT at walmart once because he was to sickly to have any hope to get better. if I had the money to get, say, 4 bettas of my choosing I'd get a VT boy like yours(any color) a OHM and a HM female and a HM male(in the color i was breeding for,probably plat.white) and then work on breeding for a VT line of platinums. xD


....and now I'm rambling. Sorry. xD Anyway, he's still by the nest which is a good sign.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Do you have the BBS and fry food prepared and ready? A grow out tank larger then the 5 gallons they are in (talking about a large tank since you can easily have hundreds of babies)? Enough jars and a way to heat each one appropriately when they need to be separated yet too young to sell? IAL? Powdered fry food? Infusoria and live foods? Where are you going to sell them all when they are older? Do you know how to ship properly? It's winter time so shipping over the next few months may not be idea..

Only reason I am mentioning this is because you didn't properly condition them- which to me shows it was a spur of the moment thing and you didn't think of the hundreds of dollars it's going to cost to raise those fry, and what to do with them at certain ages, and where you are going to keep hundreds of babies and young adults... and you didn't condition.. especially mass produced pet store bettas. You will most likely have to cull (kill off) a lot of those babies.. will you be able to do that?

There is a ton more you need to do.. since it seems all you did was throw 2 in together (which you are very lucky neither had gotten hurt as that normally happens when not properly conditioned and introduced).

I'm sorry if I come off rude but you just created hundreds of little lives and unless you have some larger tanks free of other fish, the proper fry food, jars, all the money needed and everything else.. such as what sort of filter are you using, etc.. it just to me makes me sad to see :(

And VT will be dominant trait there with those. And nothing wrong with VTs, as I like the "classic" betta look..
 
#9 ·
Wow, ok, first of all I said I have the means to raise the fry. I have an empty 55 gallon aquarium in the garage I could use for growout but was leaning more towards large rubbermaid tubs. I was thinking of building some sort of floating individual housing for the males.. that is even if I get any fry... As for a progress report, the male is still guarding the nest and I do not see any fry.

Did you not read that my local fish store will buy adults at 1/3 the price they sell them for?

Also I have had these two for four months feeding frozen bloodworms, brine shrimp, and omega one pellets. I've heard you only have to condition for 2 weeks, 4 months is not enough?

I have infusoria cultures growing, not to mention the tank is very densly planted so it should be colonized with infusoria as well. I also have a microworm culture and powdered food, although I've read that betta fry usually won't take powdered food. I've also looked onto feeding egg yolk, which worked well when i raised guppies, but I've read conflicting evidence on egg yolk for betta fry... Some articles say its the best, some say microworms.

If you had read my post I think I addresses most of those concerns already...
 
#10 ·
And I did not just throw the two together. I put her in a plastic breeding box for about 24 hours and when I released her they began spawning within about 10 minutes.

Yes I have money needed to buy supplies, jars if I decide to jar the males. Not to mention I keep my garage at 80 degrees since it is my herp room (we have 6 snakes in there) so I could easily put jarred males in there. I hate that you assume I am uneducated, at least ask questions and wait for answers before you pass judgement. I have read every article I can find on breeding bettas. I am able to do the right thing. Right now I'm not even sure if I will get fry or not.
 
#12 ·
Myates isn't asuming you are uneducated... we just want to make sure you know what is in store for your first spawn. you could do all the research in the world by internet, books, videos.. but when it comes down to actually doing it you'll be surprised how hard it can actually be :lol: Just remember, that the pheremones given off by larger fry will slow the growth of the others, so a lot of water changes will be in store :eek: lol. I didn't even find an article on that, until after my first spawn.

You might get some combtails, or VT with slightly longer rays.... messy tails, or straight up VT :) VT is dominant, as are certain colors over others.
 
#13 · (Edited)
A note on the microworms VS eggyolk thing. The thing with egg yolk is that, inmy experience, unless you have alot of fry it mostly just messes with the water. I've never fed microworms but alot of people love them as long as you don't over feed with them since it can cause your fry to have no ventral fins.

All my past spawns have readily accepted dry or non-living foods as long as that's what they were introduced to first. my very first spawn has no live food untill they were old enough for chopped blood worms. Their first food was decap BSE and sperulia(or however it's spelled) powder.

r
EDITED to add:

Also, if you have a 99cent store by your house, they sell many different sized containers. I plan on getting a few on their plastic shoe boxes since they stackable(room for air holes or slits)and long. A little air tubing, aquarium slealent and a stopper neat the bottom of them makes for easy draining for water changes
 
#14 ·
I have had only one problem with egg yolk... my fry refused it. powdered food, live food (Baby brine shrimp, microworms, infusoria) all are pretty good, depending on your picky babies :lol: and some are rather messy :eek:

And I never knew microworms caused the missing ventral fin problem... why is that?
 
#15 · (Edited)
It sounds like you have a good plan and did your homework.....lots and lots of different ways to spawn and rear fry...it can vary based on you, your breeders and what you have on hand and it sounds to me like you have a pretty good setup....now we just gotta get these eggs hatched.....lol......you have several days before you have to worry about adding any food since they will feed off their yolk sac for 2-4 days and with a mature system and live plants you may even have longer....that is how I do mine too-a more natural method.....mass live plants can create lots of microorganism for the fry......

You have to understand that we get members both young and old- that don't do their research, have a plan or have any idea what they are getting themselves into when spawning this species....like you are.....you did your homework......I don't think the other posters meant to offend you....its just you are one of the few New members that sound ready- along with the understanding of what it takes and with a plan......

Since he is still tending the nest-it could be any time now before you start to see any bouncing babies......lol......it can take 24-32h depending on temp and pH.....

Keep us up dated....

*Edit-microworms-it has been associated with missing ventral fins in the growth and development stages of Betta fry, however, from my understand of the research-its not the microworms per se-it the bacteria that they create when rotting on the tank floor that causes the missing ventral.
 
#16 ·
I wasn't meaning that you were clueless, I had seen in another 2 threads that you mentioned you only had 3 tanks- 5 gallons being the largest, and "This time around I just happened to have one male and one female because thats what my kids picked for their tanks. I thought "hmmm, let me put them together and see what happens"" seemed that you were not conditioning them and had not made plans, and that the tank they are in is the male's home, and have gravel and many small plants on the ground, which tend to not be idea for a spawn tank. I took all that into consideration before asking if you had proper means to care for all the fry.

I do hope you luck with the spawn.. and I'm sorry that I can be over protective as I have seen too many that have not done the research try and end up with too many deaths.
 
#27 ·
I have a sand substrate, and I wasn't concerned because I don't need a ton of fry, so if a few eggs get lost, they will most likely get eaten by my malaysian trumpet snails in the sand.

my largest tank is a 29 at the moment. I have two 55 gallons, one is empty and the other holds my ball python.

And yes the spawn was in the males tank, but I already put the female in my 29 gallon today and she loves it. He will be moved to her 5 gallon as soon as the fry are free swimming.
 
#17 ·
some males will eat the free swimming fry, but others will chase them and put them back in the nest :lol: just giving a heads up hehe...
 
#19 ·
So true...lol....they do love to keep us on our toes.....lol......and sometimes they eat the eggs/fry due to a health problem and that is what we want them to do....do our culling for us....and some males will eat eggs/fry if they are disturbed to much too....when they feel a threat-they will eat the eggs/fry for the protein for energy to spawn later when its safe and some are just egg/fry eaters......I give mine 3 chances and then I will artificial hatch their eggs......
 
#20 ·
Again, I want to apologize.. (and my correction of a 29 gal community) the tubs will be fine to raise the fry in, the room sounds good- humidity being good for their labyrinth. Just keep in mind the water will be cooler then the room temp. I would recommend setting up the 55 gallon soon, or the tubs as you don't really want the tank to be cycling while the fry are in it at such an early stage.

Best of luck!
 
#28 · (Edited)
Again, I want to apologize.. (and my correction of a 29 gal community) the tubs will be fine to raise the fry in, the room sounds good- humidity being good for their labyrinth.

Best of luck!

sorry was busy with the kids today, I didn't see this post till just now. No worries, I really do appreciate good advice, I just would like to be able to answer some of the questions before you pass judgement ;)
I consider myself an educated person, although I do make mistakes, which is why I spend a little time on the forums, not only researching and researching, but to gain insight from others experience.



EDIT: I also apolagize, re-reading my initial post I didn't mention some of the crucial information so I can see why you were mislead. I have another log running on a different forum and I mentioned there that my local fish store will buy decent sized bettas for 1/3 of the price they can sell them for. I am not thinking I would make a profit.. lol... but it is better than nothing.

Sorry if some of my info is repeated. I was at the doctors office waiting room with my kids (routine pediatric checkup) answering questions via my phone so my thoughts may have been a bit scattered.
 
#21 ·
I also run two filters on my 29 g and can easily use seeded filter media to seed new tanks. I am no stranger to water changes either.

if I do put the males in individual rubbermaid containers , my garage is our herp room and is usually 80 degrees ... We have 6 snakes. I suppose I cools also set up flexwatt on shelves to heat the tubs with a thermostat. There are lots of options, and I'm not sure if I am even going to have fry yet....


When I get home I will update and thank you all for the info.
 
#22 ·
well that's good :) hehe might not be a stranger to normal water changes.. :lol: fry water changes is crazy lol
 
#25 ·
definitely :lol: depending on what kind of dad he is, you can leave them in until they are free swimming... I took my male out, even though he was wonderful with them throughout their young uncoordinated free swimming age... just, it is tiring for the dads :lol:
 
#30 ·
I do a lot of different things and if I don't have something to do I get depressed... I am a registers nurse and I have worked in the Emergency dept since I was 19. (Started as a tech while in school). It is in my nature to stay busy and nurture.

Last year I rescued a baby squirrel and was up every 2 hours feeding it with a 1ml syringe and ordered specialty formula.

Occasionally I will take in a pregnant female cat, usually a stray someone doesn't want and I raise the kittens, get the momma and all the babies fixed , dewormed, and vaccinated... and rehome them. At least that way if someone let's them go they aren't reproducing. And I have a good relationship with a local low cost spay and neuter clinic.
I've also nursed abandoned kittens which are actually much easier than squirrels..

So just to give an insight in my nature and to ensure to those doubtful that I will do things the right way. ;) why else would I be here asking for as much info as possible

Oh and my daughter will be 5 in Feb and my son turns 3 in April. They both go to preschool, I would not attempt this when they were babies... Lol.
 
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