First time breeding: Advice needed on conditioning and my pair

[flyingpony22]

Hi everyone!

So I've been creeping on this forum for awhile and I finally decided to take the plunge and try my hand at breeding bettas. I selected a pair off of aquabid and I was just wondering what everyone thought of them. To be honest I don't really have a specific goal in mind. This is attempt is mostly to experience first hand how breeding works and get an idea how how color and form is passed down to the spawn before I invested more money on an imported pair.

The pair are 3 and a half months old siblings. The mother was a blue and pink red with white trim halfmoon and the father was blue with blue steel halfmoon. (Is 3 1/2 months too young to breed them? Should I wait until they're a little older?) I'm hoping to get a lot of shades of blue out of the spawn.

Both arrived safe and sound two days ago. The male looks like the picture, (hope I attached it right and everyone cans see what I'm talking about haha) he didn't chew his fins or anything which I was really happy about. The female however was so stressed out, poor thing. She arrived almost completely white, although her fins have grown out and are not tattered like in the picture. She's slowly gaining back her color and doing great, but it'll prob be another day or two before her colors are as vibrant in the picture.

My question is what should I feed them to condition them? I was planning on giving them another week or so to adjust to their new homes before beginning but I just wanted to stock up in the mean time. I have hikari bloodworms which I feed my fancy goldfish, so I was planning on giving it to the bettas as well but I was wondering what other types of frozen food everyone else fed their bettas, how often/how much etc. I was also wondering if anyone fed their bettas live food. I know it's largely frowned upon in the goldfish community because live food can introduce parasites and diseases but I wasn't sure if the same theory held up for bettas as well or if they were a little more resilient to it? Basically any help/advice is greatly appreciated.

My next question is on shipping. I live in NJ so ideally when this spawn matures it'll be towards the end of the winter. Does anyone ship fish during the winter, provided it's express and with a heat pack? I just want to start thinking about what I'm going to do with the spawn when it matures.

Thanks!

[VictorP]

This pair is very nice! Also do you know their genetic background? They look to have some dt genes in them. They have above average form as well.

[flyingpony22]

Thanks! I'm really happy you think that they have good form. I don't know about their genetic background. I just asked about their parents and the breeder didn't mention that either were double tails so I just assumed they were both halfmoons. Double tails is a recessive trait so if they do carry the trait it will show up in some of their spawns, correct?

[BettaHeart]

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?t=116065

this thread helps ^^^

[laynisample]

I don't know about shipping during the winter... I would personally wait until mid winter to breed them so they could be shipped a little later. If you have any culls you don't want, I'd take one. ;) I don't plan on breeding until way down the road, but I can't wait to see the babies those two have.

[flyingpony22]

Yeah, you're right. Ill prob wait until mid December so then I'd be shipping the end of march beginning of April which is prob better :) I still have a few more things to buy before I'm completely ready to spawn. Who knew there's so many little things to buy that add up to be so much :P

When I bred I'm gonna make a spawn log so feel free to follow along and of course you can have dibs on one or a pair if you were ready to breed at that point. I'd actually prefer to sell to people off of this forum/aqua bid cause I feel like they'd take better care of the betta then just unloading them at the pet store. So I'm glad you're already showing interest in their spawn :)

[laynisample]

lol I don't think my college would appreciate a betta breeding facility in my dorm...

[indjo]

@Flyingpony: I would not breed them. Notice the female has a bent top line. IT may become worse if you bred the two - they show signs of rose tail which often carries defects. I would pair the male to a non related delta tail - specifically a delta that has pointy caudal edges. Or to a non related 4 ray HM with pointy edged caudal. You should produce some nice HM that you could breed further.

I'd also wait until they are at least 5 months or so. You will have a better survival rate ... and more mature male. BTW the male has exceptionally wide ventrals - absolutely gorgeous. Congrats.

[flyingpony22]

I knew the male bordered on being a rosetail and that this can introduce problems with the fry but I thought the female was ok. If I were to breed them do you think the fry would have too many problems? Or rather would their flaws be noticable to the untrained eye? I don't plan on showing them ever really but at the same time I don't want to spend a lot of time and money on a fry that has hugely noticeable flaws.

[indjo]

I'm not concerned about their form, actually. But rather on potential genetic defects. If you know there were no defected siblings, you can try breeding them. But if even one showed physical defect, it's best not to breed them. Once the defected genes get into their line, it's hard to breed out. Even if you took a perfectly healthy individual out of the batch and crossed it to an unrelated betta, you will still have defected genes. I'd rather stay away from unknown rose background (in terms of rose effect).

If your male is healthy and crossed to an unrelated female, he may produce some gorgeous fry. But if he still produces unhealthy fry, I suggest you retire him and cull ALL of the fry. If they turn out healthy and you want to create roses, simply inbreed the excessive ray siblings. But then breed out again - best not to inbreed roses.

I'm not saying that he won't produce gorgeous fry with his sibling. BUT he will also (possibly) spread defective genes which will be carried for generations. Some people don't care about ... say the 50% unhealthy fry and cull them .... take the gorgeous formed fry and sell them. IMO it's irresponsible to distribute defects. . . . . . just my opinion.