Question about Prime

[finnfinnfriend]

So that means that it shouldn't turn back into ammonia...

[Hallyx]

No, fff, that's not what it means. I took this question over to TFK, where more members are more knowledgeable. Master aquarist Byron Hosking posted on the thread, as did Olympia, a water chemistry expert.

This is the result so far: http://www.tropicalfishkeeping.com/f...e-work-120683/

[ZergyMonster]

Thanks for the information, I will do some more research. I was unaware of the 24-48 period of effectiveness and how exactly it converted to ammonium (I, also, only know a rudimentary level of chemistry). I may or may not post again based on if I learn anything that hasn't been posted yet.

EDIT: I have E-mailed the makers of the product in hopes of a response. I will see what they have to say.

[ZergyMonster]

Okay they got back to me.

Hello Charles,

Thank you for the email. Prime detoxifies ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate by converting them into a non-toxic iminium salt. If after 24-48 hours, the biological filter has not consumed the ammonia, nitrite, or nitrate, than yes, they will be re-released. This is why we always recommend during cycling to add Prime every 24-48 hours until the ammonia and nitrites are zero.

I hope this clears up any confusion. If you have further questions, please let us know.

Which means that I was wrong, you do only have 24-48 hours of ammonia protection. The only natural way that I know of to remove ammonia, if it is in the water, is to have plants to used up ammonia such as duckweed and anacharis.

[Hallyx]

Hey, Zergy,

Thanks for posting that info on the Prime thread over at TFK. I found that whole experience exhausting. With the notable exception of Byron Hosking (he is notably exceptional) and Olympia, I found the respondents marginally rude, less well-informed than I'd expected and, in one case, incapable of framing a logical argument (something to do with a lack of reading comprehension, I think.)

I probably should have taken the question directly to Byron in PM, but I thought we could all learn something. Well, that certainly was the case. Hehehe...

One of the most important parts of the discussion was Olympia's graph and the chart I referred to. It shows that if the API test kit reading for ammonia is 0.25ppm at 7.6pH (for example), the toxic 'free' ammonia is really only 0.007ppm at 80*F.

Now I have to find out why mosquito larvae are considered good food, while bloodworms (midge larvae) are considered candy.

[Hallyx]

Just for the record: In conjunction with Seachem’s response too ZergyMonster, here are two more replies from Seachem—the first to Byron, the next to Abbeysdad.

Seachem: The nitrite is still completely available for the beneficial bacteria in the bio-filter to consume it. After 24-48 hours, when the Prime is no longer active, if the nitrites are still present and have not been consumed by bacteria, then yes, they will be re-released. Unfortunately, there is not a test kit on the market that will distinguish between the bound form of nitrites and nitrates and the unbound form. So the best option is to continue to add Prime every 48 hours until you are able to get a zero reading for nitrites. Most ammonia test kits out there are the same in that they cannot distinguish between free ammonia and total ammonia, simply giving you one reading for total. This can be misleading, especially when you are trying to cycle a new tank. Both our Multitest: Free and Total Ammonia and our Ammonia Alert, can distinguish between the two, making it much easier to know exactly what is going on inside your aquarium.


This is Abbeysdad’s question and Seachem’s response:

Abbeysdad: So why does the chemical bond that detoxifies ammonia, nitrite and nitrate fail after 24-48 hours?
It is perhaps a moot point in an established aquarium, but can be a large issue in a newer setup.

Would it be safe to add the recommended dose of Prime every 24 hours for an extended period?
Are there any negatives in doing this? In such a case, will the repeatedly dosed Prime become inert in the water chemistry?

Thanks for your attention.

Answer:

Tech Support EH
Administrator

Re: Prime questions...
Thank you for your questions, Abbeysdad. All water conditioners only have the ability to bind to ammonia, nitrites and/or nitrates for a limited period of time; Prime actually will do this for a longer period than any other product available. You're correct; in an established tank, the beneficial bacteria will consume these things within this time period. However, in a new setup or cycling tank, we recommend dosing Prime every 48 hours to keep the ammonia/nitrites detoxified. As long as you are using Prime as directed, there is no harm in adding it this frequently for an extended period of time. Every 24 hours should not really be necessary, as it will remain active for up to 48 hours. We hope this answers your questions!