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Old 02-11-2013, 01:57 AM   #41 
dougan
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How should 82 F water feel to the touch? I just placed some in the palm of my hand and it feels cool to lukewarm.

The temperature on the thermometer is hovering just above the 82 F mark, but not far enough to be 83 F.
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Old 02-11-2013, 09:09 AM   #42 
callistra
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It will feel about the same temperature as the inside of your wrist, or slightly cooler.
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:12 AM   #43 
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Then maybe the thermometer isn't completely accurate because the water felt a little cooler than that.

I continued to monitor the thermometer after my last post and the temperature eventually reached 83 F and showed no signs of stopping. I looked up reviews of the heater on Amazon and it has received many unfavorable reviews where many of the reviewers state that their heater continued to heat the water; one user claims up to 90 F.

So I unplugged the heater for about 35 minutes and when the thermometer read 82 F, I plugged it back in. I set my cell phone to wake me up every 30 minutes so I could check on the thermometer and continue to add water from the tank and into the cup. Right now the thermometer is reading about 81 F.

So I'm going to get another heater. The problem is I already know what they have at my local Petsmart and none of them will fit my 1 gallon tank, so I'm going to have to overnight one from Amazon, but I think that both the Marineland Visitherm and the Jager probably won't fit either. The Petsmart did have one from Fluval that's not adjustable, but may fit my tank at an angle.

I still need to buy a bigger tank, but when I research those, some users are unhappy with them because as I said earlier, apparently some filters can suck up the fish. If I get a 2 gallon or a 5 gallon, is it safe to not use the filter to avoid this? Also, the bigger tanks seem to be taller, and I am trying to avoid making my fish in his current condition swim and struggle even more to the top of a taller tank.

I poured the water of the Solo cup out and began refilling it. The flakes wouldn't come out and I've since tried to get them out with a spoon, but they keep fluttering away and I feel like I'm disturbing him too much. He has pooped a couple of times and I did manage to get those out of the cup.

Around the time of my last post, his breathing seemed labored and fast. Now not so much. I'm not sure if this is good or bad, and I'm a little stressed that he's getting stressed by being in the cup for such a long time (4:30 PM MT today will be 24 hours). But I'm too worried to drop him in the current tank because of the uncertainty of the heater.

My thoughts are this: I need to overnight I heater from Amazon and either overnight a new tank (despite some of the bad reviews) or just buy one from Petsmart (despite those same bad reviews). I need to wash that aquarium and then set it up for him to live in. But again, I'm worried about him having to swim further to the top, in addition to needing another 24 hours to properly test the new heater (sorry about that, Callistra).

Any thoughts? I guess I could get a new tank and only fill it partially to the top, that way he won't have to swim to the top while he's healing. But how long can I safely keep him in the current setup (floating him in the Solo cup)?

Also, Callistra, I only have a bird's eye view of him since he's in the cup, so I can't really determine any color change or fin clamping. But he's at the bottom and his gills are slowly moving.

Thank you all again.
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:30 AM   #44 
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It should be accurate within a couple of degrees. Your inside wrist is more sensitive. Your fingers will feel different, and touch isn't a good accurate measure anyway. I would trust the thermometer.

1 gallon is too small anyway so it seems now is a good time to upgrade. a 25w adjustable heater can be used in a 2g-5g and a 5g can also accommodate a 50w

Petco and Petsmart sell standard rectangular 2g and 5g glass Aqueon (or other brand) tanks and you can use those without a filter. I would however suggest placing a small air stone (use airline valves to turn bubbles into a light mist) under the heater to distribute the heat or you will have hot/cold spots. You can buy a glass lid for them too or even use cellophane over the top and leave a slit in the side or back for air to get in and out.

I think he's okay in the cup, just make sure you are doing twice daily 100% water changes and I would use prime as your conditioner. Because ammonia builds super quick in the cups.

Last edited by callistra; 02-11-2013 at 10:34 AM.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:46 AM   #45 
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Okay, I filled an extra 1 gallon tank with tap water and treated it with 2 drops of Prime and let it sit for 15 minutes.

I then removed the floating cup he's currently in from the current tank and halfway filled a new Solo cup with the current tank water.

I poured as much of his old cup water out and poured him into the new cup (with the flakes. I'll see if I can find that turkey baster that Majesticstorm mentioned).

He's now floating in the tank in his new Solo cup and I made up the difference in water level with the Prime-treated water from the extra tank (the water level was below the minimum required for the heater).

I will be on my way to Petsmart to get one of those standard fish tanks you mentioned, Callistra. Also, the only valves I saw yesterday are gang values and a type of T-valve (looked like brass) that splits a line into two different directions. I'll look again for the airline valves, though.

Other than a very small Pet's Barn that I did go to yesterday, we don't have anything other than Petsmart, so I may have to overnight the heater.

Okay, then. I will update as things happen.

Thanks so much for your patience.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:44 PM   #46 
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Airline t valves yeah, some may be metal.. all of mine have been plastic. http://www.brineshrimpdirect.com/mc_...rflow_copy.jpg I actually use two per line, one close to the filter and one further down. One I close off all the way and the other I adjust to allow just a mist. I like Kordon Mist Air stones best, but I've used Elite too and also some blue bubble wands by marineland and I really love the wands.
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:54 PM   #47 
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Update

Update:

I went and got a 5 gallon tank from Petsmart (see photo). They only had 2.5 gallon basic aquariums, not 5 gallon basic tanks. Although the person that was helping me did show me some 5 gallon terrariums, but the covers were such that they wouldn't accommodate the power cords of the heater and air pump without modification, so I bought the Marineland tank. It came with a filter, but I'm wondering if I can go ahead and forego its use.

They don't have the airline valves, but they did have an airstone that makes fine bubbles. Will that work as well as airline valves? I still need to go back for some more vinyl tubing.

I went ahead and got a Top Fin heater. Reviews are not great, but I wanted to get started on heating the new water and testing the heater. As I'm writing this, the thermometer in the 5 gallon tank is reading just over 74 F. I'm not sure whether I have the heater set to 75 F or 79 F because of the markings on the heater. The squares up to 75 F or filled solid red and there's a red diagonal line on 79 F.

I also did an ammonia test on his cup water. I'm not sure if you can tell from the picture, but the ammonia at the time registered at 0.5 ppm, so I went ahead and did a 100% water change (with the water in the tank that I'm using to float him).

I then did an ammonia test on the water in the tank. It looked to me like it registered between 0 ppm and 0.25 ppm. So that's the water he now has in his cup.

And I took a couple of current photos of him. In one, he was coming up for some air, and in the next, he goes back down to the bottom of the cup and that's where he spends most of his time. His gills are still pale.

One other thing to note is that I saw him appear to yawn or gasp when he was in the 0.5 ppm water. I only saw it once, but I'm not staring at him continously.

So that's where we're at right now. I really hope he makes it.
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Old 02-11-2013, 10:14 PM   #48 
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Dougan,

Awesome job on the tank. I actually use two of those myself for my bettas Azure and Carnage. One warning, though, I'd actually find something to cover that opening up in the front, one of my fish actually jumped out of that overnight once and died v.v

Instead of getting rid of the tank, though, I used the lid from the new fish's betta cup (I had to decide whether to scrap the tank or save it quickly before the bacteria died) and placed a 1-pound container (my kH booster, go figure) on the lid. It leaves a small gap that I can drop food into and covers up the opening so that my fish can't jump out of it.

I have that heater for my fish Axel at the moment too, it's done very well for me for almost two years, though I know how heaters can really be hit and miss (ex: me and the Marineland xD)

The airstone is perfect, you don't always need a filter for bettas, especially in smaller tanks, but aeration is always a plus.

Make sure you get him plenty of gravel to make a nice one-to-two-inch bed in the bottom. Lots of silk/cloth plants and ornaments are good as well so he'll have lots of hiding places.

I'm very happy you decided to upgrade. I think the little guy will be, too :3

EDIT: Also! If you see that the temperature in the tank isn't quite reaching what you set it to, I'd take the heater and turn it horizontally and place it close to the bottom. Sometimes, the thermometer's closer to the top in some heaters and the heat it produces rises, which the thermometer reads only in the top section and decides the tank is heated enough and turns off, while the bottom is still cold.

Last edited by Azurelove; 02-11-2013 at 10:23 PM.
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Old 02-11-2013, 11:17 PM   #49 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurelove View Post
One warning, though, I'd actually find something to cover that opening up in the front, one of my fish actually jumped out of that overnight once and died v.v
I'm really sorry about your fish. When I bought this, I hadn't considered that. Which is weird because when I looked at some of the other tanks that were pictured without a lid on the box, I thought to myself, "No way, he might jump out".

Do you cover up the back opening, as well?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurelove View Post
Instead of getting rid of the tank, though, I used the lid from the new fish's betta cup (I had to decide whether to scrap the tank or save it quickly before the bacteria died) and placed a 1-pound container (my kH booster, go figure) on the lid. It leaves a small gap that I can drop food into and covers up the opening so that my fish can't jump out of it.
I think I'm visualizing this correctly, but I'm not sure. Would it be too much to ask to upload a photo? And what do you mean by saving the tank quickly before the bacteria died?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurelove View Post
I have that heater for my fish Axel at the moment too, it's done very well for me for almost two years, though I know how heaters can really be hit and miss (ex: me and the Marineland xD)
I really have to watch the little 10W heater that I'm using to keep him warm right now in the 1 gallon tank. The thermometer starts to read what looks like a solid 83 F. Last night I set my cell phone to wake me every 30 minutes so I could get up and check on it. It seems to fluctuate between 83 F and just about the 82 F mark. I've been in a bit of a panic mode since this whole thing started and I got really worried yesterday when I realized I had not followed Callistra's instructions on heat acclimation properly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurelove View Post
Make sure you get him plenty of gravel to make a nice one-to-two-inch bed in the bottom. Lots of silk/cloth plants and ornaments are good as well so he'll have lots of hiding places.
I think I may stick to the glass gravel so I don't have to worry about chemical changes due to gravel. The problem is I'm going to need a lot more of it for this new tank. In addition, I've seen his fins get wedged in between the glass gravel a few times and he struggled to get out.

Also, if I switch his food to the pellets (right now I'm using the Omega flakes) those pellets that he misses are probably going to be inaccessible to him once they sink to the glass gravel.

What kind of gravel do you use?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurelove View Post
EDIT: Also! If you see that the temperature in the tank isn't quite reaching what you set it to, I'd take the heater and turn it horizontally and place it close to the bottom. Sometimes, the thermometer's closer to the top in some heaters and the heat it produces rises, which the thermometer reads only in the top section and decides the tank is heated enough and turns off, while the bottom is still cold.
I was thinking that I may reduce the water level by 1/3 - 2/3 when I introduce him to the new tank and have to do this regardless, because I don't want to make him have to struggle an even further distance to the top while he's still healing.

Which brings up another question as to when I should introduce him to the new tank, when he's fully recovered, or once I see the new heater is maintaining temperature properly in the new tank?

Thank you for that tip, by the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurelove View Post
I'm very happy you decided to upgrade. I think the little guy will be, too :3
Thank you very much. I feel like I owe it to this little guy. This is probably going to sound silly, but my heart breaks when I look at him and I see how uncomfortable he is. And I worry he won't make it.

Right now, he's totally just staying at the bottom of the cup. Just earlier today, if I moved it a little he would come up for air and go back down. But now he's just hanging out at the bottom and when he does swim, it's along the bottom to another side of the cup.
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Old 02-12-2013, 12:33 AM   #50 
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Callistra, I was just looking at another post where you asked the poster (Azurelove, I think) the color of the fish's poop.

Earlier today I mentioned that last night (early morning hours) my fish had pooped, but I failed to mention that they were like three tiny black pieces. It occurs to me now that that may have been blood in the poop.

He hasn't eaten at all today and he hasn't pooped either.

Earlier today if I moved the cup even slightly, he would come to the top for air. He isn't coming up anymore. When he swims, he just kind of swims along the bottom of the cup to another position.

His gill movement is the same.

Might he have internal bleeding?

I'm also about to perform another 100% cup water change.
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