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Old 03-08-2013, 12:57 PM   #1 
Otterfun
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Help: Dropsy / Columnaris??

So not sure what she has ... I thought she had dropsy with the raised scales, and was healed, but then I saw scales in the WC cup and strings of 1mm translucent white strands on her body and they detach when she swims in the cup. She went around and ate them … please help….

Oh, read that columnaris is an aerobic bacteria and raising temp. may actually help the bacteria, so I lowered the temp naturally last night and set heater to restart at 78F and added copule drops of Excel to the vase.

Log of Curious Grace
daily 100% WC with Prime & Stress Coat + at 50/50
1.5g unfiltered Vase with 16" diameter, 10” deep of water
heated with 50W Adjustable heater
driftwood (has been QTed for a month)
2 x 6" stems of anacharis:

Day 1 (Saturday) 78F:
happy exploring new place

#2 color : black-brown

Day 2 (Sun.) 78F :
lethargic but staying at the top of the 1.5g temp vase with clamped fins when resting, no appetite.

--Thought it was stress and getting acclimated to the new QT environment that she enjoyed swimming around on Saturday and Sunday.

no #2

Day 3 (Mon.) raised from 78F to 84 F with heater,:
lethargic but staying at the top of the 1.5g temp vase with clamped fins when resting, no appetite
raised from 78F to 84 F with heater, CG gets acclimated in the tank as temp rises to treat dropsy per Disease Sticky #2.

observed raised scales and used 5cc/1g ES.
CG responded with some swimming.

treated with Maracyn (dose# 1).

no #2


Day 4 (Tue.) : 84F:
lethargic but staying at the top of the 1.5g temp vase with clamped fins when resting, ate a tiny pinch of freeze dried daphnia.

reduced amount of raised scales, used 5cc/1g ES
CG responded with a little more swimming when I am around.

treated with Maracyn (dose #2).

#2 color : terracotta

Day 5 (Wed.) : 84F
staying at the top of the 1.5g temp vase with clamped fins when resting, gobbled 3 NLS soaked in Garlic Guard quickly in the WC cup

only a little bit of slightly raised scales around the body near the tail (1/8”), other parts flat, used 5cc/1g ES.
CG swimming actively when I am around.

treated with Maracyn (dose #3) and Maracyn II (dose #1).

#2 color : terracotta

Day 6 (Thu.) reduced temp from 84F-78F naturally

staying at the top of the 1.5g temp vase with periodic clamped dorsal & pectoral fins when resting, other fins relaxed, ate but not gobbled 3 OO pellets soaked in Garlic Guard

no more raised scales but observed scales loss?? (floating transparent pieces coming off when CG swims in WC cup), and tiny white threads hanging from body, CG ate some of them swimming around the cup during WC...[IMG]file:///C:\DOCUME~1\kchim2\LOCALS~1\Temp\msohtmlclip1\01\c lip_image001.gif[/IMG]

used 5cc/1g AQ Salt, reduced temp from 84F-78F naturally. CG some swimming, responsive to me, and active. treated with Maracyn (dose #3) and Maracyn II (dose #2).

#2 color : terracotta
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Old 03-08-2013, 01:26 PM   #2 
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Nobody can see photos saved on your computer. You need to upload them to the web.

It sounds like your betta is shedding his/her slime coat.

Epsom salt should be dosed at 1 tsp p er gallon..

Don't use meds, and epsoms and aquarium salt.. just more stress.. I would continue epsoms and maracyn 1 and 2 in combo for an additional week and 14 days total.

However, how are you diluting the meds for this size container? I'm concerned due to the behavior that the meds are not being dosed properly..

Also, how did you acclimate to the warmer/new water?

How are you monitoring the temperature in this vase? 50w in something so small is very dangerous and I do not suggest it unless it's a REALLY good 50w that keeps perfect temp with no swings. The reason is, with this large heater (good for 10x that size tank) it can raise and lower temps way too quickly, causing lots of swings.
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Old 03-08-2013, 01:51 PM   #3 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callistra View Post
Nobody can see photos saved on your computer. You need to upload them to the web.

actually I did not have photos taken but will take some tonight.


It sounds like your betta is shedding his/her slime coat.
Do you think it is allergic to Stress Coat+ since I read here that some fish are allergic to it.

Epsom salt should be dosed at 1 tsp p er gallon..

I think my cup says 5cc = 1 tsp, but will use the tsp measuring side to do it.

Don't use meds, and epsoms and aquarium salt.. just more stress.. I would continue epsoms and maracyn 1 and 2 in combo for an additional week and 14 days total.

ok

However, how are you diluting the meds for this size container? I'm concerned due to the behavior that the meds are not being dosed properly..

i separated the bag into 1/10 dosage and apply them according to the prescription since day 1 for M II is higher, but after that both M & MII are the same dosage.

Also, how did you acclimate to the warmer/new water?
I turned on the heater and then drip and remove some water in the WC cup every 10 min. (3 Turkey baster's worth of water) as the heater heats up. When heater stops, I have 2 more drips and started floating the cup in the tank (10 min) before releasing her into the tank.

How are you monitoring the temperature in this vase?
PetSmart floating thermometer.

50w in something so small is very dangerous and I do not suggest it unless it's a REALLY good 50w that keeps perfect temp with no swings. The reason is, with this large heater (good for 10x that size tank) it can raise and lower temps way too quickly, causing lots of swings.
It's an Aqueon 50W that has 1F+/- even in this small vase. I observed it for an hour that it turned on and off to respond to changes before trusting it.

Last edited by Otterfun; 03-08-2013 at 01:58 PM.
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Old 03-08-2013, 02:46 PM   #4 
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It's a sign of fish disease or really bad water quality issues.

You can't dry eyeball meds. That's really inaccurate way of dosing and could account for the behavior. You should dissolve the full packet (which treats 10g) in 10 measures of treated/tank water.. 10 tablespoons, 10 cups, 10 whatever. Then take 1.5 measures of the mixture and put it into his 1.5g vase.

My experience with standard aqueon glass heaters (and I've been through quite a few) is that they were all highly inaccurate and caused massive fluctuations.. Is your in tank thermometer showing fluctuations?
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Old 03-08-2013, 03:02 PM   #5 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callistra View Post
It's a sign of fish disease or really bad water quality issues.

I did my daily 100% WC so I suppose it is a disease.

You can't dry eyeball meds. That's really inaccurate way of dosing and could account for the behavior. You should dissolve the full packet (which treats 10g) in 10 measures of treated/tank water.. 10 tablespoons, 10 cups, 10 whatever. Then take 1.5 measures of the mixture and put it into his 1.5g vase.

Thanks, I do not have a 10g container to do that...any thoughts?

My experience with standard aqueon glass heaters (and I've been through quite a few) is that they were all highly inaccurate and caused massive fluctuations.. Is your in tank thermometer showing fluctuations?

my thermometer, 2 PetSmart floating ones, in the same tank, do not show variances and correctly reflect those 1F+/- when the heater is on or off. During WC time, when they are out of the water, they also mirror each other in the room temp reading.

i have had excellent expereinces with my 3 Aqueon 50W in 5g, 2.5, and this 1.5g, sorry to hear of yours.

Last edited by Otterfun; 03-08-2013 at 03:16 PM.
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Old 03-08-2013, 03:18 PM   #6 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callistra View Post

Don't use meds, and epsoms and aquarium salt.. just more stress.. I would continue epsoms and maracyn 1 and 2 in combo for an additional week and 14 days total.
Yes, I switched from ES to AQ Salt, I use one salt at a time.
Will switch back to ES tonight.
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Old 03-08-2013, 03:22 PM   #7 
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The +-1 fluctuations, meaning 2 degrees daily fluctuations aren't good, especially considering how fast a heater of that size would heat something that small. That could be stressing your fish out. My heaters all drop a max of 1 full degree and back up a day but they do so very slowly. The problem with yours is really the quickness it would happen is a big concern in something so small, especially considering the behavior of the fish.

Also meant to add that when you mix up the meds to dose, you have to toss the excess mixture. You can't save it and redose the next day because the meds lose their effectiveness. IT will have to be mixed up fresh before each dose.
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Old 03-08-2013, 04:02 PM   #8 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callistra View Post
The +-1 fluctuations, meaning 2 degrees daily fluctuations aren't good, especially considering how fast a heater of that size would heat something that small. That could be stressing your fish out. My heaters all drop a max of 1 full degree and back up a day but they do so very slowly. The problem with yours is really the quickness it would happen is a big concern in something so small, especially considering the behavior of the fish.

Oh, ok, now I am confused. The heater turns on when it is 1F below preset and stop when it reaches the desired temp and maybe 1F more, so you are saying that this is not good? So did you mean that the heater should stop at the exact temp? What recommendations do you have as heater?

So immediately turning on when it drops 1F and having it reach the desired temp within 2-5 mins is bad? So I should get a slower heater that takes a longer time to warm up the water ? The water drops in temp within 5 mins, so I am seeing the heater go on and off and I thought it was a good sign.

I am not following you.


Also meant to add that when you mix up the meds to dose, you have to toss the excess mixture. You can't save it and redose the next day because the meds lose their effectiveness. IT will have to be mixed up fresh before each dose.
Ok, so what can I do besides eyeball to allow me to separate the portions and toss the excess amount? any thoughts since having a 10g container is not going to happen...
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Old 03-08-2013, 04:24 PM   #9 
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For something of that size I would use a 25w Marineland Visitherm but other 25w heaters should be ok in that size, or at least better. The reason it sometimes goes beyond the set temp is because it heats so fast. That's the biggest concern. One degree temp dip isn't a big deal.

What I said in post #4 for dilution.. did you see it?
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Old 03-08-2013, 04:40 PM   #10 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callistra View Post
It's a sign of fish disease or really bad water quality issues.

You can't dry eyeball meds. That's really inaccurate way of dosing and could account for the behavior. You should dissolve the full packet (which treats 10g) in 10 measures of treated/tank water.. 10 tablespoons, 10 cups, 10 whatever. Then take 1.5 measures of the mixture and put it into his 1.5g vase.

My experience with standard aqueon glass heaters (and I've been through quite a few) is that they were all highly inaccurate and caused massive fluctuations.. Is your in tank thermometer showing fluctuations?
Quote:
Originally Posted by callistra View Post
For something of that size I would use a 25w Marineland Visitherm but other 25w heaters should be ok in that size, or at least better. The reason it sometimes goes beyond the set temp is because it heats so fast. That's the biggest concern. One degree temp dip isn't a big deal.

What I said in post #4 for dilution.. did you see it?
Oh, so is it like this:1 packet with 10 oz water, then 1.5oz dissolved solution into 1.5g vase?

ok, I'll get the 25W adjustable, then.
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