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Old 03-16-2013, 08:10 PM   #1 
monica12980
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Unhappy Eye problem with my betta

What size is your tank? 5 gallons
Does your tank have a filter?yes
Is your tank heated? no?
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? no

What type of food do you feed your betta fish? Nutrafin flakes
How often do you feed your betta fish? Once every two days
How often do you perform a water change? weekly, give or take a few days
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 25%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? water conditioner and aquarium salt

How has your betta fish's appearance changed?her pupils look glassy, her tail 's begining is clamped, but not in the velvet way
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? not yet
When did you start noticing the symptoms? yesterday, back from a seven day vacation to cuba(cousin took care of fish)
Have you started treating your fish?no, what should i do?
Does your fish have any history of being ill? i think not
How old is your fish (approximately)? 1 year and a half

please reply. my betta means a lot to me. and while you're here, my fancy goldfish has dropsy.
tank 29 gallons
normal temparature
filter
heated
What tank mates does your gold fish live with?
Gaea the oranda lives with Tum and Shimmerali, two bigger comet goldfish(as big as your keyboard's numbers from 1 to 9 ) and Elizabeth and White Death, size 1 to 5. gaea is that big also, but fatter

How often do you feed your fish? daily, with flakes

How often do you perform a water change?week
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change?25%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change?the same

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your gold fish's appearance changed? Dropsy
How has your gold fish's behavior changed? not really
When did you start noticing the symptoms? 9 days ago
Have you started treating your fish? continuing normal water changes and stuff
Does your fish have any history of being ill? they all got ich (cured)
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Old 03-16-2013, 08:12 PM   #2 
monica12980
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oh and if you are going to say the goldfish will die, i know that will probably happen but are there any treatment options? i love ny fish.
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Old 03-17-2013, 10:42 AM   #3 
callistra
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I think the problem is simply your keeping habits..

If your betta's eyes look cloudy, this is a bacteria infection caused from chronic poor water conditions, and judging from other keeping habits also a weakened immune system.

First off salt cannot be used for more than 10 consecutive days, and only if your fish is actually sick. It also never breaks down or evaporates so if you are using it, it should only be added along with a water change. Using salt for a longer period, when fish is not sick, or continuing to add without changing the water will simply breed resistant infections which will make the salt useless when the fish is actually sick. It can also lead to premature organ failure. If you have been adding salt on a regular basis, it needs to be discontinued now.

For the betta:

The size of the tank is good.

Your water change routine isn't even enough for a fully established tank, which should be 50% weekly with siphon. However cycling takes up to 2 months and there are any number of reasons it may break down later. Anytime you are not doing weekly 100% changes you really need to own a reliable drops kit for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.

You need to be testing daily with a reliable drops kit for ammonia and nitrite and doing an extra 50% change any time you see either, even as little as .25ppm. In addition to this a weekly 50% with siphon is needed to remove poop and other debris from the gravel. It is not enough to just scoop water off the top ever.

First you will see ammonia, then nitrite. Eventually, hopefully, you will see ammonia fall and stay at 0 even after a week of no water changes, and finally nitrite. At this point you will be left with only nitrates after a full week of no changes and these can be kept <20ppm by twice 50% change with siphon.

However, Most filters designed for these small tanks also have fatal flaws that will not allow the biofilter to establish in them as well. You should never replace all filter media at once. You should only replace one type of filter media within a month, and the best filters have 3 different types of media. However, most of these small only contain one type of media that needs to be replaced monthly due to it containing carbon. Every time you replace all the media at once you wipe out most of your biofiler and basically start your cycle over again. The surface area available to grow this biofilter is also usually completely inadequate to support the load of the fish.

So what filter do you use and how to do you maintain it?

Bettas are tropical fish and must be kept at a temp between 76-82, with 78-80 being ideal. The temp must be stable and not be dipping or jumping around. In a 2 gallon you can get an adjustable 25w or 50w heater. Any new heater should be tested for 24 hours in similar size container with in tank thermometer to make sure it will hold a constant appropriate temp between 78-80F. Then the betta must be acclimated to higher temp either by floating in a cup inside the main already fully heated tank for an hour, or by adjusting the heater to increase the temperature of the tank no more than a degree per hour and 5 degrees per day.

Flakes aren't good nutritional value, and especially with something this small they muck up the water quickly causing excess ammonia. You should look for a good quality pellets whose first two or three ingredients are whole fish, not fish meal or wheat. He should be fed two small meals a day (how many depends on the pellet you pick up) and one fast day a week.

--------------
* Answer my questions above
* Discontinue salt if it's been more than 10 days.
* Get a testing kit
* Get a heater/thermometer and slowly acclimate to higher temps
* Get on top of water changes.. 3 50% water changes an hour apart now and then maintain as above
* Adjust feeding habits
* Share photos as your betta may need antibioitcs

All water changes should be done like this to avoid shock and minimize stress

Quote:
The 50% changes the betta can be kept in the bowl and use a turkey baster to remove half the water and as much of the debris as possible. For the 100% you need to remove him - scoop him out with a plastic solo type cup and set aside while you thoroughly rinse the bowl and gravel to remove the debris. Then he should be acclimated to the new water by floating for an hour while you slowly add a couple tablespoons of new water to the cup every 10 minutes. When you release him, try to let as little of the old cup water back into the tank as possible. All water changes should use same temp water, matched to running tap using the in tank thermometer and the water needs to be premixed with conditioner before adding it to the betta tank. If you don't already have anything, you can use gallon water jugs from the grocery store - rinsed thoroughly in hot water but no chems.

Last edited by callistra; 03-17-2013 at 10:44 AM.
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Old 03-17-2013, 10:50 AM   #4 
callistra
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Now for your comet goldfish..

Goldfish are cold water fish and do not need a heater.. some require a chiller. What is the temperature of the tank?

Your goldfish require a 100g tanks with 200g worth of filtration.. So they are suffering from chronic poor water conditions. too. You need to upgrade them or rehome them.

Same thing exact thing you are doing to cycle your betta's tank and get up on his water quality you need to do for your goldfish.

To treat the dropsy, first you need to do the above. Then get epsom salt 100% pure magnesium sulfate with no additives of any kind. The ingredients label should be checked and it should not smell and it should be white. I get mine from CVS Pharmacy. You predissolve 1 tsp per gallon in separate container outside the tank and add slowly over an hour. 12 hours later you can do this again. Salt does not evaporate or break down so only add back with a water change and only add as much back as water you change. Do this for 2 weeks and hopefully your goldfish will survive but with such heavy overstocking it will be next to impossible as ammonia will just build so quickly..
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Old 03-17-2013, 02:26 PM   #5 
Oldfishlady
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In a 5gal filtered tank housing a single Betta-provided that you don't overfeed-IMO-weekly 25% with vacuum should maintain water quality. I do agree on the use of long term salt-its not needed or recommend for this species. Nutrition might be an issue, however, IMO that would be more related to frequency of only one kind of food-than the food itself. Temp may or may not be a factor-without a thermometer and temp it is hard to say, however, if you have kept her for 1.5 years without a heater-I can only assume your temp is within normal limits.

You have had her for 1.5 years or is she 1.5 years old-has she ever been spawned-No past health issues or treatment and her S/S are glassy eyes, clamped fins-Not cloudy eyes or bulging eyes-she is still eating and responding to you-not lethargic...correct.....
Any live plants and additives other than the dechlorinater and salt.

What I would recommend at this point-make some small water changes 25% daily for 4 days-since we don't know what the nitrate reading is and assuming she has been in this tank for 1.5yrs and if its old tank syndrome you don't want to make too large volume water changes too soon-that will come later or with more info-
Assuming she is still eating-improve her diet by feeding good quality varied diet in small frequent meals. If you have access to live mosquito larva offer them several times a day.
We also can't rule out age-she might be aging out and not a lot can be done.
If she is lethargic, hiding...etc...you might want to turn the filter off or place her in a QT that can be floated in the tank to maintain temp. Dim lit quiet location-but if she is otherwise acting her normal self except for the glassy eyes and clamp fins-You may not need to QT yet..Will need more info and a pic.....

As for the Goldfish, I can't help you much with them, however, Olympia and several other members are well versed in Goldfish care and you might want to post in a different section with just the Goldfish issues.
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