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Old 10-09-2013, 05:52 PM   #11 
Lefitte
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Thanks for the tips Anhel! I've been keeping the temp at 86 degrees and also doing some salt to keep finrot at bay. I'm considering disinfecting everything I can but for now I've pulled out everything except the gravel, plant, and terracotta pot hide. He did have a moment of nitrite poisoning a few days ago and he was looking absolutely awful. I tested the water, saw the level at 1ppm and immediately did a 60% water change which brought the nitrite down a to .25ppm. Not great but he was definitely feeling MUCH better. Ever since then he's been improving daily. His fins still look awful but a lot of the ich has fallen off. I see very very few small 'grains of salt' on his fins. I did a large water change last night [wanted to do a full change but I could not get the pleco out to safe my life and I was fearing that I was hurting him so I did about 80% instead. He's such a little thing, so easy to hurt!
Due to some advice from a friend, I've changed my conditioner to Kordon's AmQuel Plus. I've also changed my food to New Life Spectrum's Betta Pellets, which seems to be much better. After last night's water change, I put a tiny piece of algae wafer in the tank for the pleco, returned to the tank a little while later to see that my -betta- was eating it... Mind you, I had fed him earlier that day. Now the poor guy's bloated *headdesk* And yes, I did suck the remaining wafer out. Now, my betta's fasting. You don't love your pets until they make you want to sometimes throttle them, right? Haha.
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:12 PM   #12 
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Thanks for the tips Anhel! I've been keeping the temp at 86 degrees and also doing some salt to keep finrot at bay. I'm considering disinfecting everything I can but for now I've pulled out everything except the gravel, plant, and terracotta pot hide. He did have a moment of nitrite poisoning a few days ago and he was looking absolutely awful. I tested the water, saw the level at 1ppm and immediately did a 60% water change which brought the nitrite down a to .25ppm. Not great but he was definitely feeling MUCH better. Ever since then he's been improving daily. His fins still look awful but a lot of the ich has fallen off. I see very very few small 'grains of salt' on his fins. I did a large water change last night [wanted to do a full change but I could not get the pleco out to safe my life and I was fearing that I was hurting him so I did about 80% instead. He's such a little thing, so easy to hurt!
Due to some advice from a friend, I've changed my conditioner to Kordon's AmQuel Plus. I've also changed my food to New Life Spectrum's Betta Pellets, which seems to be much better. After last night's water change, I put a tiny piece of algae wafer in the tank for the pleco, returned to the tank a little while later to see that my -betta- was eating it... Mind you, I had fed him earlier that day. Now the poor guy's bloated *headdesk* And yes, I did suck the remaining wafer out. Now, my betta's fasting. You don't love your pets until they make you want to sometimes throttle them, right? Haha.

With the wafer, that happened to me too. XD I just made sure not to feed him for two to three days and he went back to normal. LOL I called mine a jerk when it happened, so yeah I at times want to throttle them. LOL
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:19 PM   #13 
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Hahaha I called mine a brat. He's sick, I was being gentle.
And yeah I've had problems with bloating with him in the past so I've got the fasting thing down by now, I hope at least. I was feeding him too much at first. A lot of things say 'however much they can consume within this time'... Well, Chi's a piggy and he'll consume everything within a minute and it usually doesn't even take him that long. I've restricted him now to 2 pellets 2x a day but now that I've changed his food and it's slightly bigger, I think I might stay with 1 pellet 2x daily. Of course, that'll come after his bloat goes down. Oh, my silly boy. He's such a handful at times. His poor tail looks awful right now but his activity level is up to normal so he's on the upside of this illness!

I seriously think I'm having so many problems with him due to poor breeding. He's the first 'fancy' betta I've owned and the first I can remember ever getting sick.
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:25 PM   #14 
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I hope your boy gets better <3. I am having the same problem keeping my bettas healthy. =( issues with fin rot and all. =/
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:38 PM   #15 
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Thanks~ I hope your boys get better too!
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:49 PM   #16 
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Since I just seem to be having one problem after another, what can I do?
I'm getting a heater tomorrow. I'm *trying* to cycle my tank, won't 100% water changes ruin the cycle? I also want to get some java moss to add to the tank, though I think I'll wait until after the ick goes away. I read that heating the tank to 86 for a short period will help kill it along with salt. Since I'm doing salt, do I need to do 100% water changes and start my cycle over again? How often should I be doing the salt to rid of ick? I only just noticed 8 tiny white spots this evening.

It all comes down to; What can I improve to help my guy *stay* healthy?
I don't think you are having more problems then any novice fish keeper. What is important is you are trying to understand what is happening and learn from it. The ich probably came from the store with your guy. From what little I know about ich you seem to be doing the right things. I also don't know how salt affects the cycle. If you are concerned just keep doing the water changes 2 X 50% twice weekly and 1 X 100% weekly. Some of the more experienced guys (gals) will chime in to help. Most important don't beat yourself up for not researching more before diving in. I researched for several weeks full time and still managed to kill four fish the first time I added them to the tank.

The second thing to remember is have patience. My favorite quote is "Nothing that happens fast in an aquarium is good".
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Old 10-10-2013, 11:33 AM   #17 
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Keep up with the temperature and daily water changes at least a wk or two after you see ich last.
I was reading the thread on the forum where someone said that 86 * is working close to not, but 88* is guaranty to work. But i guess if you see the improvement with 86 then it is helping. But still continue the treatment about 2 wks after you think they don't have it.
I know that you said that you will transfer pleco to his own tank. But is there any way you can keep him in the separate hospital tank? I think every fish can have different immunity and different out come after treatment . I don't know i think i am a little paranoid but i like to be more safe . Also you saying that you are using salt , are you sure its ok to use salt for your pleco? Not all species tolerant to the salt. And are they both in 2.5 gall? Or i am wrong? Do you think they nipping ? Its way tooo small for both of them.
Also i was thinking you already treated your betta with aquarium salt before. It is not recommended to treat with salt longer than 14 day. And if you can raise the temp up to 88* you don't even need to use the salt. With the temp parasites just can't complete their life cycle and simply will fall off and you will remove them with a water change. Salt is little stressful on fish , if you don't have to use it. As for the fin rot you doing daily water changes now , so it should help with mild fin rot. You also can add a bit of stress coat for the fins healing. Stess coat has Aloe Vera and very good for the healing.
Are you using the filter?
If you don't use the filter alternate daily water changes between 50% and 100%.
I would not cycle 2.5 gall especially if you don't have a testing kit.
You said that Petco checked your water and it was 0.25 ammonia. Not sure if anyone mentioned that Prime by Seachem is most recommended in the situation like that because it converts ammonia to ammonium for 48 hrs, which is less dangerous. So if you have this problem try to get Prime and try to do 2-50% water changes and one full wter change and still check the ammonia. Sorry you already bought another water conditioner though. Not sure if you can exchange it?
Overfeeding is bad and can cause the swim bladder problem in the future. I don't even know why the bottles would write so wrong instruction :( The people who don't know will do that and it very bad.
NLS if it the one that i posted the link of , they are 1 mm you really can give him 2 in the morning and 2 at night . NLS most recommended on the forum , they are good and also have garlic in it which is also good for them immune system.

About disinfection. It the easiest way to disinfect after ich. All you really have to do just rinse with hot water and let it dry out for a wk or more. No host ich will die. So if you disinfect you don't need to use any solutions.

Last edited by ANHEL123; 10-10-2013 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 10-21-2013, 05:02 AM   #18 
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Update!

Chi was doing quite well after taking everyone's advice and using the increased temp. After seeing the last ich drop off, I did a 50% water change, making sure to vacuum the bottom really well and swish the filters in the old water. I've been doing 50% about twice a week and with the hose and bucket I have now, it's really decreased his stress during water changes a lot! I was even seeing some regrowth in his dorsal fin! Unfortunately, things didn't stay so great and we've backslid a little. Chi now has poor color [it was improving] again and some ich on each side by his gills and one on his left eye which I'm afraid will end up blinding him! He was acting extremely sick last night, not acting himself at all but he's doing much better mood-wise today. I've increased the temp from 86 to 88 and added a little salt which seems to be why he's doing better.

In other news, on Sunday I fell in love with this other betta that just happened to catch my eye as I walked past the shelf at Petsmart. I said goodbye but couldn't stop thinking about him. After last night when I was afraid that I would wake up to a very sad sight in my tank [and happily didn't!], I decided that I should get that 10g hospital tank that I'll need for when I eventually get a 20g. He was still there. I have now welcomed a second betta into my home and I'm so enjoying him so far. Despite Chi's illness, he's taken to watching his neighbor with interest and without showing any discomfort [I'll block sight of them if that becomes a problem]. The new 10g is a bare minimum set up for now and I've found a hitch to my 20g plans [I don't trust that counter to hold a 20g plus more so I'll need to save up for one with a stand instead and figure out where to put it, my mom and I have that tank figured out perfectly and we can't wait to get it set up so this is a sad set back]. Since I have this set back with that tank, I'm going to set up this new 10g more than originally planned and use it to start growing some plants that I will eventually house in that tank. Not sure where my new boy will remain housed at [and I am tempted divide the tank for both boys but there are multiple reasons that's not the greatest idea] but I'll come up with something even if I end up buying a second 2.5 minibow to house him.
I did see ich on the new boy the first day I saw him but he looks quite healthy today! As a precaution, I'll be slowly raising the temperature in his tank as well.

The new 10g tank houses only the new betta male. Chi's tank sits next to that with the pleco and amazon compacta within.
The new tank only has a little bridge for a hide, a heater, and a thermometer that sticks to the outside. Within the next week, I'll be getting a few more things for the tank such as a better thermometer, a filter [I had other plans regarding the filter and the 20g which have sort of fallen through at the moment so I'll need something now], and probably some sand for the bottom. I also have a marimo moss ball that's going to stay in its cup for a couple weeks in quarantine. I've learned my lesson and now my favorite thing will be quarantining all the things.

The new boy is quite the beauty.
Click~
I think he's a Halfmoon Plakat mixture [like how Chi has some crowntail in him]. If the black outline of his tail is hard to see, that's because it's see through and my phone takes terrible aquarium photos. That blue-teal color is his true coloring and not a trick of the lighting. So pretty~ I might have some trouble with him flaring at his reflection too much in the future though. Chi found him rather fascinating to watch though, while the new boy didn't seem to notice him at all. I'm excited to see his personality develop. I love Chi's personality a lot and this one seems quite the opposite, Chi is very curious but very laid back.

Wish me luck!
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Old 10-21-2013, 11:18 AM   #19 
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I really wish you good luck , your new guy is beautiful. I am kind of scare of the big tanks though. For 7 years i have 2.5 gall tanks so its too complicated for me lol And i hate to share the tanks because if you have one betta sick he will contaminate whole tank.

Well the fact that Chi still has ich is worries me. Ich is fatal and very contagious to your new betta. So you really can not share anything between them. And the fact that he has it again is might be because you didn't completely get rid of them. They can reproduce and it will be more difficult to get rid of them. You need to continue with the temperature and water changes at least one wk after you see ich last on the fish. So keep with 88* but i really recommend 88* not even 86* since he has them for long time now and some people really saying that it a big diffirence between 86* and 88*. 88* i s more effective .
The temperature is more important than salt. And keep tank dark ,do not use light if you have it in the tank. Ich using light to reproduce. Some times if the ich stays for long time i think they can hide in the gills and it more difficult and longer to get rid of them. So do 88* do not stop even if he feels better continue with heat and water changes at least 2 wks after you see last. I am not experience with filtered tanks though. All my tanks without a filter. The reason i am saying that because i really think it is better to do daily 100% water changes or at least alternate daily between 50% and 100%.
What dose of salt you using? The minimum theraputic dose is 1tsp/gall with daily water changes. You can increase salt up to 3tsp/gall but you can not use it longer than 14 days
So its up to you if you still want to use filter which you don't have to if you will decide to do full water changes. If you will continue to do 50% daily water changes and still use the filter it fine i guess too.
About your new guy. Again DO NOT CROSS CONTAMINATE ANYTHINKG between both of them. Do not share the siphon or any thing else.That is why i don't like to share the tank, if one get sick then you have all tank and other fish contaminated. So if you think he has one spot of ich then it will miltyimpyed ,so keep 88* and keep it for minimum of 14 days. I understand he is in 10 gall but you still need water changes. So try at least 50% daily water changes with the temp. For the new guy i would not add salt . If it not a lot of ich and its in early stage the 88* should help. And you don't want to stress him out with the salt. And rinse the siphon in the hot water after each use. Hang it vertically so the water can drip out and it will air dry . The ich dies without parasites.

I know i am tooo too careful and i know that a lot of people didn't have the problem but there is a chance that you always can bring ich even with a live plant or with new fish. Watch this video my POST #10

http://www.bettafish.com/showthread.php?p=2036738
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Old 10-27-2013, 05:03 AM   #20 
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Update!
Since my last post, my dad has once again returned to the hospital so I've been struggling a little to keep up with the more intense care for my boys. Good news/bad news.
Chi; he's still alive! Trust me, there's been many mornings that I thought for sure he'd be floating when I woke up. I haven't seen any more signs of ich, his water is kept at about 89 and I've been doing 50% water changes twice a week (which is about every day off). The last change I did stirred up so much ich that next time I do it, I'm definitely going to try for a full change if I can at all. Not only does it stress him but I've had trouble netting my pleco... I did get most of the stirred up stuff out with my net though! His color is still awful, his tail is so very shredded, and he is officially blind in at least one eye. He had trouble finding his food tonight. I'm going to try to up the water changes as much as I can because his nitrate levels have been getting quite high. They may not be as dangerous but I would rather them be lower. I'm still running the filter and using AmQuel and NovAqua. I'm still feeding the boys NLS Betta Pellets. Chi also has a major problem with bloating so I feed him 1 pellet twice a day, or two once a day.
Kirei; Kirei is doing fantastic! His poor 10 gal looks so bare with only his bridge and one of Chi's old trees (I took it out months ago and nearly boiled it the water was so hot). I got him a better thermometer (submersible) and have been keeping the water at about 82. I will be lowering it to the regular 80 soon, there have been zero signs of ich or other illness. I also got him a Tetra Whisper EX20 filter. I like my filters. The current is a little strong so I plan to baffle it more than I already have. It only bothers him when he swims directly in front of it near the very top. He is a silly boy! I keep the lights off mostly because I need to make sure of what's really going on. I suspect he can see his reflection because the second I turn it on he starts flairing at eeeeverrythiing. Cat! Flare! Face! Flare! Oh, heater, gotta flare! But after a few minutes he settles down, I only leave it on for short supervised periods. He's still very active and curious and I'm very much enjoying him!
I've decided that Chi definitely has some bad genes. With all his problems... some were not helped by me (no heater for first coldsnap causing ich outbreak, for example) but with the care I've been giving, I don't think everything can be explained away without thinking about poor genetics. My poor boy. We hope to one day see his beautiful color and tail return. He really is a delight! I love him dearly.
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