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Old 09-29-2013, 09:35 PM   #1 
Zombinator1
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He's Pale Again-Please Help ASAP

Hello Again,

My fish Zombie that I posted about last week, has fallen pale again. I will answer as many of these questions as possible. Please help if you have any advice.

Housing
What size is your tank? 5 Gallon
What temperature is your tank? 78 Degrees
Does your tank have a filter? No
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? No
Is your tank heated? Yes
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? None

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? Varied diet of pellets, flakes, freeze dried blood worms, blood worms and Brine Shrimp.
How often do you feed your betta fish? Several small meals a done, with a one day a week fast.

Maintenance
How often do you perform a water change? Twice a week
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? One 50% and one almost to 100% a week
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? Betta Safe

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?

Ammonia: .0
Nitrite:
Nitrate:
pH:
Hardness:
Alkalinity:

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? He went from a vibrant red, to a dull, very pale pink color.
How has your betta fish's behavior changed? He is not moving very much at the top of the tank, sort of in a daze.
When did you start noticing the symptoms? A week ago.
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? Last week I noticed he was more frantic and lethargic, so I put in AQ salt, and when I came home he was floating at the top of the tank, extremely pale. I moved him from his tank, put him in a one gallon bowl, with clean water, treated him for four days with Betta Revive. On the 6th day, I put him in a 5 gallon tank, with clean water. He was doing fine, and has suddenly fallen pale again.
Does your fish have any history of being ill? At this point I would say yes.
How old is your fish (approximately)? I could not say.
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Old 09-29-2013, 10:32 PM   #2 
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While I can't explain the paleness. I am wondering if something in your tank is the cause since he did better in the one gallon. If no one responds with better advice try moving him back to the one gallon and see if he perks up. If he does then you might need to figure what the problem with the tank is. (which we can help you with) It does look line you are overdoing the water change for a five gallon especially if the tank is cycled. You might be getting a nitrate spike which could cause paleness.
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Old 09-29-2013, 10:38 PM   #3 
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Would Epsom salt be a good thing to try with him there? The tank isn't cycled, which is why I do more water changes. I am also slightly nervous about moving him back to the bowl, because I am having a hard time maintaining a 78 temperature, and because two days in the bowl he also got a bit pale, but not as bad as he is now.
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Old 09-29-2013, 11:03 PM   #4 
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Can you post a photo? Or even better - can you post a photo of what he used to look like, when he was bright red, and a second photo showing how he looks now?
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Old 09-29-2013, 11:08 PM   #5 
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Just a theory, but maybe it could be SBD? I am thinking this because the AQ salt seemed to have made matters worse, which would be the case with SBD.
Then again it is also very possible that there is something toxic in the 5 gallon.
I would probably dose epsom salt and see what happens, it couldn't hurt.
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Old 09-30-2013, 12:04 AM   #6 
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Well I am terrible, and when I put in the Salt I did not dissolve it first. It did not say to on the label, or in the articles I read, then I stumbled across some posts and read that you are supposed to do that first. So yeah, I am a dummy. And did that-if that helps in diagnosing him. I also noticed that I think his Inter orbital region is slightly bulging.

I will have to look and see if I have pictures. And get back with that.

Mostly I am afraid to use any more salt, because I don't want to make it worse, at the same time he has been so off and on the past week.
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Old 09-30-2013, 12:15 AM   #7 
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I was not able to find a before, but here is what he looks like now:
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Old 09-30-2013, 01:51 AM   #8 
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His PH is 7.6 by the way. In fact I think it's higher.

Last edited by Zombinator1; 09-30-2013 at 02:06 AM.
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Old 09-30-2013, 03:34 AM   #9 
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I went to Wal-Mart to get some distilled water, was planning on replacing half of his already water with that.

I am still very new to all of this stuff, and don't know much. But could it be that the already high level of PH from our water, was escalated once I added the salt? Draining him and stressing him out? Or am I just way off base, and the problem will still persist after I replace some of the water?
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Old 09-30-2013, 04:12 AM   #10 
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I agree with Jada, it really does sound like it's connected to something in the 5g.

So, he only goes pale when he's in the 5g, correct?
When he's in the smaller bowl, he's more vibrant and acts better?

How long was he in the 5g before he went pale the first time?

Does he seem any different after a water change?

Don't feel too bad about the salt, I did the same thing with one of my guys in the beginning. I almost killed him with it, poor Buckley. :( I think we've all made mistakes like that before.

At this point, I'm wondering about several things, one being that there's something in the 5g that's polluting it and causing him to have issues; two, that he can't handle the space of a 5g and becomes stressed by it (not common but it does happen); three, that the water conditioner is somehow bothering him; four, wondering if the betta revive and/or the salt are somehow causing an adverse reaction (even with new water, if everything isn't rinsed off there could still be a residue).

If it is the 5g causing a problem, can you fit the 1g *into* the 5g? If you can, or even if you have a big bucket, Rubbermaid, or even a pot or something that can hold water that you can put the 1g into, you can heat the larger container full of water and keep his 1g at the correct temp with your 5g heater. Does that make sense? :)

Paleness usually indicates stress from something more than a disease. I think that if we can just isolate what's bothering him, we can figure this out. :) There are enough experienced people on this board, surely we can figure it out! :)
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