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Old 08-11-2010, 02:50 AM   #21 
FloridaBettas239
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I was just asking, and it kind of suck's why your breeding them. I could see experimenting if you were a good size breeder to see what you could posibley add to your line. It would be okay to breed them if you were and IBC member then you would no what to look for, because you may get some half sun's but the rest are going to look like fin rot and a web duck's foot. Now if you new the IBC standard's and was starting your own line to try to make a pattern and forum you have in mind. But this is not the case, your just breeding just cause and pet store bettas at that and 2 different fin type's without a future plain.
I don't get it if your gonna breed, at least join the IBC. It's only 20 dollars, and then you no what to look for and better the breed.
Plus when you sign up, you can get a free pair of show bettas from a winning breeder. There's a reason show breeder's seperate there selfs from pet store betta people, and it's because of stuff like this here. We are trying to better the breed and others just set it back. I try to talk with people about getting a decent pair and they don't care they ride right to petco and pick up a pair, and then breed them. It's like talking to a wall, waste of time...! it would be the end of the world if they had to spend 10 or 15 dollars extra on a good betta..
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Old 08-11-2010, 07:42 AM   #22 
indjo
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I can understand FB's point of view, becuase he is too IBC oriented. Such views will advise the termination of undesired fish. But keep in mind that not all are IBC oriented. Some can really admire what IBC calls mutts. Remember that "QUALITY IS MERELY WHAT PLEASES THE HEART". So instead of criticizing, someone for their courage to learn, I suggest that we encourage them with views that will improve the quality of their bettas. Whether they listen or not is up to them.

For example; The male may not be a show quality but it is close and can be improved. How? First, determine what's wrong with it - thin fins, long anal fins, and still has a slight stain of red (this is only my quick analysis, just an example..... btw I apologize to angelus if this offends you).
Now, consider what type of betta is available to angelus that fits her budget. Let's say that VT's are the only type she can get. No problem. I would advise a solid similar color or green (to get rid of the red stain). Make sure that the female has a thicker/stiff fins and her anal fins does not exceed her tail. Yes, angelus would have to inbreed extensively to eventually achieve her goal. But it's a start toward IBC's standards.

..... that is only my opinion; we cannot force people to expand IBC's interests. ...... If I were narrow minded, I would question "Why do Americans buy VT's, mutts, etc?" (You see, we ship A LOT of mutts to the states. WHY!? Simply because that is the demand - as long as they are colorful, they are desirable). So, again I suggest that we respect what pleases other individuals. Don't discourage their enthusiasm to learn (specially the younger generation). Instead we should point them in the right direction.
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Old 08-11-2010, 10:53 AM   #23 
Oldfishlady
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Very well said Indjo.....and I agree....
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Old 08-11-2010, 11:25 AM   #24 
Sarada
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I love my mutt betta, he seems stronger and has more character then the others. Perfect for my 3yr old son ;)
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Old 08-11-2010, 11:31 AM   #25 
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I can understand FB's point of view, becuase he is too IBC oriented. Such views will advise the termination of undesired fish. But keep in mind that not all are IBC oriented. Some can really admire what IBC calls mutts. Remember that "QUALITY IS MERELY WHAT PLEASES THE HEART". So instead of criticizing, someone for their courage to learn, I suggest that we encourage them with views that will improve the quality of their bettas. Whether they listen or not is up to them.

For example; The male may not be a show quality but it is close and can be improved. How? First, determine what's wrong with it - thin fins, long anal fins, and still has a slight stain of red (this is only my quick analysis, just an example..... btw I apologize to angelus if this offends you).
Now, consider what type of betta is available to angelus that fits her budget. Let's say that VT's are the only type she can get. No problem. I would advise a solid similar color or green (to get rid of the red stain). Make sure that the female has a thicker/stiff fins and her anal fins does not exceed her tail. Yes, angelus would have to inbreed extensively to eventually achieve her goal. But it's a start toward IBC's standards.

..... that is only my opinion; we cannot force people to expand IBC's interests. ...... If I were narrow minded, I would question "Why do Americans buy VT's, mutts, etc?" (You see, we ship A LOT of mutts to the states. WHY!? Simply because that is the demand - as long as they are colorful, they are desirable). So, again I suggest that we respect what pleases other individuals. Don't discourage their enthusiasm to learn (specially the younger generation). Instead we should point them in the right direction.
lol. I'm not offended. thanks. We'll see what the babies are gonna look like. That's all we can do right?
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Old 08-11-2010, 01:01 PM   #26 
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I just think someone should have a direction there going in, not just cause they want to see what it make's. If you want to experment on starting your own line or type of betta then sure no problem. But you also need to no a fishes standard's if your going to try to make something, unless you dont care and you just trying to make bad mutated fish. Which is just hurting the future of the betta splenden by putting them kind of fish out there.
I dont see nothing wrong with having pet store fish, but if your going to breed would it kill you to spend 10 or 15 more dollars to start off with a decent pair, then more people want the fish and instead of year's and year's of breeding that pet store fish to try to improve it, you just did with 10 or 15 extra dollar's. And your putting money in the breeder's pocket's that deserve it.. Plus there still going to be a lot of improvment's you need to make you just shaved a couple years off by buying decent stock..
And yes there's people buying pet store bettas all the time, more then half of them people dont no about the betta world dont no about the show side of thing's. And when they find out they want that AB betta or whatever.
And all im saying if you are going to breed the pet store betta and not spend 10 or 15 exrta. then at least take the money and join the IBC so you no how to better the fish. Not just cause more problem's
That's why you see most of the betta show forum's dont deal with this stuff and these people, because they are working year's and year's to try so hard to make a great betta. And then you got these people that dont care that are just setting back all that hard work just putting these bettas out there. It's crazy how people dont care, It's like if some of these people had a zoo they would be like let's breed a bear with a lion and this with that lol I want to see what happen's. I guess Just got to brush it off and laugh and try to help the one's that really want it.......
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Old 08-11-2010, 01:54 PM   #27 
Adastra
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I know where you're coming from and I definitely agree with your point of view despite the fact that I don't think you're expressing yourself very well in your last two posts--they come off a little arrogant and abrasive, remember--you'll catch more bees with honey than vinegar. People don't necessarily need to be members of IBC, but I agree that people should put more effort into talking to other breeders, looking at what's current, and that they should breed for a purpose using quality stock that they have an understanding of the history of. IBC just happens to be a great way to do that.

As for this situation, what's done is done and angelus said he'd do the best with finding the fish homes. It's good to advocate for what you feel is right, but at some point you need to acknowledge that some people are just going to do what feels right for them, so you need to say your peace in one politely worded post and move on to subjects that are relevant to the topic. Who knows, if the OP sees you as a successful breeder role model, maybe he'll be more inclined to see things your way. :) At this point we need to shift the focus back to helping the OP with any issues he might run into with his fry.
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Old 08-11-2010, 03:35 PM   #28 
dramaqueen
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I agree with Adastra.
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Old 08-11-2010, 04:32 PM   #29 
angelus2402004
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I know where you're coming from and I definitely agree with your point of view despite the fact that I don't think you're expressing yourself very well in your last two posts--they come off a little arrogant and abrasive, remember--you'll catch more bees with honey than vinegar. People don't necessarily need to be members of IBC, but I agree that people should put more effort into talking to other breeders, looking at what's current, and that they should breed for a purpose using quality stock that they have an understanding of the history of. IBC just happens to be a great way to do that.

As for this situation, what's done is done and angelus said he'd do the best with finding the fish homes. It's good to advocate for what you feel is right, but at some point you need to acknowledge that some people are just going to do what feels right for them, so you need to say your peace in one politely worded post and move on to subjects that are relevant to the topic. Who knows, if the OP sees you as a successful breeder role model, maybe he'll be more inclined to see things your way. :) At this point we need to shift the focus back to helping the OP with any issues he might run into with his fry.
I'm a she. :)
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Old 08-11-2010, 05:42 PM   #30 
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Sheesh. maybe humans should enact laws that make it only so that the beautiful perfect people can have children (under the supervision of scientists and geneticists). Then we can get rid of all the mutts and "uglies".

Its a fish. In the end, the only thing 99% of the world cares about is long fins and pretty colors.
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