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Old 09-08-2010, 05:24 AM   #1 
indjo
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Screwed up genetics

This is off topic from the original thread where it was discussed so I started a new one. It was said that pet store VT's has screwed up genetics. How screwed up can the genetics of VT's be? I've always considered them to be the most pure genetics (in terms of tail type) because they are seldom mixed with other tail types - at least not by mass producing breeders. Yes, their colors are constantly mixed. But aren't the bright multi color of these betta their main attraction?

I would agree if it was said that the genetics of pet store modern tail type betta's were screwed up. Because they are constantly experimented on, both for tail type and colors.

I know this is a dumb question, but I really have doubts to its meaning and would like to make sure that I have it right. What do you exactly mean with "screwed up genetics".
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Old 09-08-2010, 02:12 PM   #2 
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IMO there are very few nice VT to be found today (in a petstore or from a breeder). The caudal fins have been mixed with PK and other tail types leading to broad based tails whereas a true VT should have a pointed caudal that slopes downward. Other fish have been crossed with CT somewhere back in their lineage and have ratty or torn looking fins. Its hard to find a nice VT with fins close to the standards floating around today.

As far as colors.. because of all the color mixing it is very hard to find a VT who's colors will breed true. Your mainly going to end up with multi's and for someone wanting to work with one color (irrids for example) it will take many generations to breed out the muttly colors in the fish.
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Old 09-08-2010, 02:35 PM   #3 
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I agree with 1f2f--because VTs have been so overbred in an irresponsible manner by the pet industry, it would be a huge undertaking to bring the VT back to the current standards and to get their patterns and colors to breed true.

The newer tail types are favored by breeders who will choose individuals carefully for a conformity to their standards and what they find desirable as far as pattern and color. From this they produce a quality line of fish whose traits breed true.
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Old 09-08-2010, 09:00 PM   #4 
LoveSGSE
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Veil tails are considered RARE in Singapore. I know over 8 breeders yet no one breed veils. Pet stores do have veil, but they are messed up. Major torn fins and sick.
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Old 09-08-2010, 10:45 PM   #5 
BettaBoy84
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Wow, interesting thread...I am currently in the procress of raising two sets of fry, 3 weeks and on week...BOTH with Veil parents..
The male was purchased from a pet store in Ontario, Canada as he was incredible when i saw him, Bright blue and shows vivd greens when he flares, havnt seen anything like him color wise..I bred him with two differnt other blue and green veil tail, both who had almost fins just as long and incredible colors..

I will keep you posted on the colors as the fry mature, but their parents (all three) are some of the finest bettas Ive seen..Wish I had pics of the females before breeding, they are in recovery...and male is still with fry..I have yet to see any bettas with colors and this bright and females fins so long, I almost thought othe one was a male before I saw eggs fall, no joke..
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Old 09-09-2010, 12:02 AM   #6 
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I really would like to see the veil tail come back... I mean, it's really what introduces most of us into the betta fish world! We see the fishies in the store with big long fins and bright colors... Sure, a whole world of different tails and colors opens up, but the veil tails are where we generally start! I think they're pretty, and it would be a shame to let them just disappear. Improving them would be nice I think, a more affordable fish but one that can be perfected too!
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Old 09-09-2010, 12:32 AM   #7 
naturegirl243
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Does anyone have an example of what a VT should look like?I would like to see a pictures of nice veiltail like a really nice VT.I have three and they all look different there is Mizu who looks like some wierd cross thing Carlisle who I thought was a nice VT and Anardil who has always had odd fins.I would just like to see a good picture of what could be a show VT if they showed VT's anymore.
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Old 09-09-2010, 04:12 AM   #8 
indjo
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Quote:
The caudal fins have been mixed with PK and other tail types leading to broad based tails whereas a true VT should have a pointed caudal that slopes downward.
I didn't know this. I thought Vt's were suppose to have a round end caudal that slopes downwards. They have always been that shape since the early 70's (in Ind). Now they are rare, but the ones I find are still that shape. I have always thought pointed end caudal were due to some illness which has made the fins clamped.

Quote:
because VTs have been so overbred in an irresponsible manner by the pet industry
This is so true. US, Canadian, and European business demands large shipments of colorful VT's. At least (I think) this was the case 5-6 years ago. So breeders just produce mixed colors, disregarding genetic flaws that occurred in the whole process.

Quote:
I really would like to see the veil tail come back...
I too wish they were appreciated more. These days most people I know would think of them as "trash" .... it annoys me. VT's are unique in their own way and are (to me) special.
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Old 09-09-2010, 08:15 AM   #9 
Adastra
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This article touches on the standard for VTs as well as other tail types: http://bettysplendens.com/articles/p...articleid=4074

I love mutty veils as pets--they're very smart and have a lot of personality. I just don't think people should use pet store veil tails for their home breeding projects, and I wish that breeding farms would be more motivated to produce higher quality lines of fish.
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Old 09-09-2010, 09:48 AM   #10 
nochoramet
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I wish people would try to bring the veil tail back, because to me, they are beautiful! I (had) 2 veil tails, now just one, but they were both beautiful. Their tails were a lot easier to keep pretty besides the occasional tailbiting because my CT's rays all melted, and Frusciante's tail (super delta) is so long naturally he just chomps it all off and looks terrible.
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