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Old 09-22-2011, 11:15 PM   #1 
BabyBoyBlue
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Exclamation Staying at the bottom, top fins torn

This started on Friday 9/16.
Noticed that he's staying at the bottom instead of his leaf hammock.
Didn't come up when I opened the lid to feed him. He waited until it came down and then ate it.

Saturday 9/17.
Same behavior as on Friday
I reduced his food to 2 pellets for the whole day. Guessing that he might be bloated, or overate by eating the cory's shrimp pellets.

Sunday 9/18.
Saw him swimming a little bit, and then settle on the floor again.
Fed him 2 pellets and 1 defrosted bloodworm which he ate.

Monday 9/19.
Saw him sleeping in his leaf hammock, and he was eating at the top again.
Fed him 4 pellets (2 in morning, 2 in evening)
Seemed to be close to normal again, although not swimming much, but at least at the top of the tank again.

Tuesday 9/20.
He went back to the bottom again.
He's still eating.

Wednesday 9/21.
Still at the bottom. He does swim up to get air and then goes back down and just sits at the bottom corner.
Noticed that his top fins might be torn a little.
Still eating.

Thursday 9/22
Went back to sleeping at the top, still eating. He moved around a little bit more, so now I can notice that the top fins are torn a bit and looks frayed.

I haven't noticed any change in colors, or spots, or anything growing on him. His behavior has just been odd this week, by staying at the bottom instead of his leaf hammock... he's still eating... but now I'm more worried because his fins are ton.

I have been doing daily water changes, and the tank as of today has 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite and 0 nitrate, and so it seems as though it has finally cycled. 10g tank.

I do have Bettafix and Melafix, but from what I understand, it contains an ingredient that's not good for Bettas.

Last edited by BabyBoyBlue; 09-22-2011 at 11:26 PM.
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Old 09-22-2011, 11:43 PM   #2 
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Housing
What size is your tank? 10 G
What temperature is your tank? 76-78*
Does your tank have a filter? Aqueon 10 Gallon QuietFlow
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? No
Is your tank heated? Aqueon Pro 50 W
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? 6 Panda Corycats

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? Pellets (Aqueon and NLS), Defrosted Bloodworms
How often do you feed your betta fish? 2-3 Pellets, twice a day.

Maintenance

How often do you perform a water change? 50% WC Everyday
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 50%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? 0.8 ML Prime

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?

Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 0
pH: 8.2
Hardness:
Alkalinity:

Symptoms and Treatment
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how? No treatments, other then reducing food and 50% WC everyday.
Does your fish have any history of being ill? He had something similar to this 2 months ago.
How old is your fish (approximately)? 1.5 years ?
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Old 09-22-2011, 11:52 PM   #3 
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Hmmm, how curious.
Perhaps he's irritated by the 50% change? on a 10 gal. you really only have to do 10-15% each week.
Maybe your changing it too much?
you mentioned that his fins are torn? Are there any sharp object in the tank that might have possibly done that? Rule of tumb: If it can tear pantyhose, it can tear betta fins.

Everything else your doing seems great, btw! :)
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Old 09-29-2011, 12:30 AM   #4 
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Ok... it has been a week.

His behavior changed a little bit. Now, he is resting up top... but not on his leaf. He's usually resting on the water heater knob at the back of the tank.

He's still eating, but is completely avoiding the front half of the aquarium. Over the weekend, I was feeding him bloodworms and skimming it on the top from the back where he was staying, towards the front. He would follow the blood worm, and then at about the halfway point of the tank, he would immediately and frantically make a u-turn, and head down to the floor.

I'm guessing my 2 year old did something and just completely freaked Blue out and now he's stressed.

On 9/26, I did a 60% water change. Tested the waters and the ammonia and nitrites are still 0. I also moved the fish tanks to a much higher shelf far away from the possible reaches of my 2 year old son.

Unfortunately, the problem still remains with his torn fins, that is actually starting to look worse ... and his stressed behavior.

I also noticed that one of the Panda Cories' tail has a big chunk that was bitten off. I've added a nice sized driftwood to the tank, which gave the Pandas a really good hiding space if they need it. But for the most part, I haven't seen Blue bothering the Pandas at all, so I don't know when it happened.

What should I do to treat Blue's torn fins, and the Panda's ripped tail?

Should I do the AQ treatment, or daily 50% water changes again, add Stress Coat?
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Old 09-29-2011, 01:50 AM   #5 
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These are the best pictures that I can get of him with his fins. (he's in the cup for only the pictures).

As far as I can tell, there's nothing sharp in the tank. All the plants are live. If he lays on the floors, it's usually near the Wisterias.

I've added 10 ml of Stress Coat to the tank. The directions says to add 5 ml per 10 gallon, and double that to repair fins.

Is this a daily or weekly dosage? Or only when changing the water?

Another note, he's still not swimming much, unless he has a destination.
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Last edited by BabyBoyBlue; 09-29-2011 at 02:04 AM.
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Old 09-29-2011, 02:12 AM   #6 
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Just to clarify, he's not a crowntail is he? His top (dorsal) fin really is shredded, not CT? His tail doesn't look so hot either.

Couple of possibilities here. One is he's picking on the panda cories. Since cories have spiky/serrated dorsal fins, the fins of the cories could be tearing up your guy when he chases and harasses them. It's a remote possibility though, since you said you haven't seen him bothering them. I know my betta pretty much ignores my panda cories and they ignore him. Seems weird that yours would pick on each other. Another possibility is he's getting caught on the driftwood. I don't have driftwood but I do have a fake cave/tunnel and I see my betta coming out of it sometimes. If your guy is exploring, maybe he's squeezing through tunnels in the driftwood that are big enough for his body but not his flowing fins (possibly being curious and following a panda cory). And a final possibility is the filter. If it's got a really high outflow, maybe he's gotten caught in the current and got his fins torn that way and he stays on the bottom or top to avoid the current. All things to check out, I guess. It doesn't look like fin rot though so that's good news.

For now, I would fast him for a day. Don't feed him any pellets. Is he in a hospital/QT tank? If you plan on doing a salt treatment, definitely move him into his own tank since the salt will harm the live plants and the cories (but you probably already knew that ). If he's still in the 10g, fast him but don't worry if he happens to eat a bit of the cories's food. I think as long as you keep the water clean, you don't need a salt treatment. Just keep using the Stress Coat with every water change. Use a full 10ml each time you do a water change for a couple of weeks. In the 10g, you only need to do a small water change a week, like 25-30% at the most. 40% at the maximum. 50% a day isn't necessary and could totally throw your cycle off.

Hope this helps you and keep us posted.
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Old 09-29-2011, 02:18 AM   #7 
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first thing that came to my mind after reading your first post .. is that betta hammock (this is really a bad product that shouldn't be sold IMO) .. did you pull out the metal wire from the middle of the stem in it ? .. cus that thing is dangerous!! >.< and i hope that's not what tore your betta's fins
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:53 AM   #8 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakura8 View Post
he's not a crowntail is he? His top (dorsal) fin really is shredded, not CT? His tail doesn't look so hot either.
I want to say that he's a halfmoon. Before this, his fins were connected and looked like a halfmoon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakura8 View Post
One is he's picking on the panda cories. Since cories have spiky/serrated dorsal fins, the fins of the cories could be tearing up your guy when he chases and harasses them.
At the very beginning, Blue would chase the panda cories, but he's pretty slow compared to them and was not even close to catching up to them. Eventually, he stopped chasing them, and would only go after their shrimp pellets. But even that stopped, as he seemed not to like the shrimp pellets so much. They would pretty much leave each other alone.

BUT, one of the smaller Panda does have a torn off tail. So something did happen at least once.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakura8 View Post
Another possibility is he's getting caught on the driftwood. I don't have driftwood but I do have a fake cave/tunnel and I see my betta coming out of it sometimes. If your guy is exploring, maybe he's squeezing through tunnels in the driftwood that are big enough for his body but not his flowing fins (possibly being curious and following a panda cory).
I had the driftwood soaking for 2 weeks in a separate container to remove most of the tannin. I put the driftwood in just recently, after I noticed that his fins were shredded.
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Old 09-29-2011, 08:55 AM   #9 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakura8 View Post
And a final possibility is the filter. If it's got a really high outflow, maybe he's gotten caught in the current and got his fins torn that way and he stays on the bottom or top to avoid the current.
I have the output baffled, so the outflow is pretty low. He currently also likes to "sit" on the heater which is right next to the filter output.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sakura8 View Post
For now, I would fast him for a day. Don't feed him any pellets. Is he in a hospital/QT tank? If you plan on doing a salt treatment, definitely move him into his own tank since the salt will harm the live plants and the cories (but you probably already knew that ). If he's still in the 10g, fast him but don't worry if he happens to eat a bit of the cories's food. I think as long as you keep the water clean, you don't need a salt treatment. Just keep using the Stress Coat with every water change. Use a full 10ml each time you do a water change for a couple of weeks. In the 10g, you only need to do a small water change a week, like 25-30% at the most. 40% at the maximum. 50% a day isn't necessary and could totally throw your cycle off.
I'll fast him for a day. Thank you for reminding me about AQ salt and live plants and cories . He is still in the 10g (don't have another tank or QT to put him in), not worried about him eating the cories' food, because I've been putting their food towards the front of the aquarium, which he avoids.

And I'll keep using Stress Coat with every water change. With the water change, I usually also use Prime. Should I add both, or just one or the other?

Thank you so much for your help!

Quote:
Originally Posted by HatsuneMiku View Post
first thing that came to my mind after reading your first post .. is that betta hammock (this is really a bad product that shouldn't be sold IMO) .. did you pull out the metal wire from the middle of the stem in it ? .. cus that thing is dangerous!! >.< and i hope that's not what tore your betta's fins
I examine the hammocks every week after reading about one impaling a betta. The hammocks still look new, with nothing out of the ordinary.
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Old 09-29-2011, 09:24 AM   #10 
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As long as you don't bed the wire in the hammok, you should be alright. But yes, just be careful.

I'd say that just give it more time. Fin re-growth can take a while. :P
His dorsal DOES make him look like a CT though! lol. Poor dear! Do you think the intake is too strong and caught his fins? That's a possibility.
As for the cory, just let him be- his fins will grow back too. :)
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