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Old 05-03-2013, 03:39 PM   #101 
Graceful
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Originally Posted by animallover View Post
These are horrible for the poor fish. I was even telling my daughter earlier that I feel bad about our community tank (29 gallon) being too small for whats in there! Any fish or animal in nature would not stay in these tiny places! Here's a couple bad ones I found if you don't mind me adding! At least the full hanging bowl is better then the wall one. I personally prefer 5- 10 gallons.

I knew I'd see my first betta's tank in here eventually. I had the hanging one of the right. Very beautiful, but very, very small.
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Old 05-03-2013, 08:49 PM   #102 
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I feel horrible for the bettas that have to live in tanks like these. In our hallway at school, there are three bettas. One is in a 1/2 gallon tank and on Wednesday I couldn't even see the fish. One is less than 1/4 gallon. One is 1 gallon and the betta gets good food and appropriate water changes. Can you guess which one is in my classroom? The worst tanks by far IMO are the fancy ones with the sea horse and chariot designs. If you are willing to spend 45 dollars on those kinds of tanks, then get one that is more than 1/2 gallon! These just make me sick:


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They are 1/2 gallons and they are in the "Indulge, Pamper, and Spoil Your Pet" section. HOW IS THAT PAMPERING?!?!?!?!?!
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Old 05-04-2013, 04:18 AM   #103 
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Yeah but really, if you think about it, every single one of us who owns a pet is, in essence, 'enslaving' that pet. We're kidnapping them from their natural environment and playing god with them. It doesn't matter if the living creature is in a teddy bear stomach or a 5 gallon tank... it's still not that animal's natural environment.

So really, I think this thread is silly since its just a slightly more extreme version of what already exists.

Okay, I do have a response to this one. (And I do not intend to start an argument or a war on this. In the spirit of adult and friendly discussion which I feel sure this post was made in, I respond in kind.) :)

For one, what we have are not wild bettas. The betta splendens that we all own are nothing like the wild bettas that live outdoors, and ours would never be able to survive outside an aquarium. The same goes for modern-day dogs, horses, cats, what-have-you.
(And actually on the point of dogs, dogs *chose* to live with humans. They are the ONLY animals who did so, but wolves actually came to *us*...not the other way around. This is part of the historical record and has been proven time and again by anthropologists.)

Second, by the very act of ownership, we are RESPONSIBLE to provide the best home to bettas, and any other animals, we own. It is *clearly* irresponsible to put a living creature into an environment that provides no stimulation, no sense of security, which will inevitably become dirty and foul, which will foster disease, which will result in unhealthy living conditions and end in death or severe unhappiness. By providing these simple things for an animal, then we have met the requirements for responsibility, and the creatures in our care are happy and comfortable.

Furthermore, these pets have never known "freedom" and can only experience what we provide them with. It is not as if we are imprisioning them after they have known a life outside of an aquarium...we are only providing them with what they have known and are happy with, or, many times, something better. I know that my petstore betta-mill rescue bettas have never known the joys of live plants, 10 gallons to swim in, other bettas which they are safely allowed to interact with, not to mention quality food and care. My bettas currently have the best possible life, and I would definitely bet the best living conditions they have ever known. I very much doubt they would trade their clean, safe, cycled tanks for a life of fear and inevitable death in a "wild" environment they are not genetically capable of dealing with.

Furthermore, I disagree with the opinion that properly set up aquariums are just "less extreme versions" of what is being posted here. In the same way that we understand it to be wrong to keep a dog locked in a bathroom for their entire life, we should also be fully capable of understanding that locking a fish in an equivalent container is also wrong! My dogs have free reign of a 2500 sq ft home, an acre of fenced in yard, they receive walks of an hour or more daily, and frequent trips to go hiking, to parks, to other neighborhoods, etc. There is no comparison between the "extreme" home of a puppy mill dog living in a wire crate to what my dogs experience on a daily basis. The same goes for my bettas. My boys who live in cycled, heavily covered, heated, 10g tanks are not comparable to the fish living in the circle bowl of doom pictured here a few times.
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Old 05-04-2013, 09:25 AM   #104 
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Okay, I do have a response to this one. (And I do not intend to start an argument or a war on this. In the spirit of adult and friendly discussion which I feel sure this post was made in, I respond in kind.) :)

For one, what we have are not wild bettas. The betta splendens that we all own are nothing like the wild bettas that live outdoors, and ours would never be able to survive outside an aquarium. The same goes for modern-day dogs, horses, cats, what-have-you.
(And actually on the point of dogs, dogs *chose* to live with humans. They are the ONLY animals who did so, but wolves actually came to *us*...not the other way around. This is part of the historical record and has been proven time and again by anthropologists.)

Second, by the very act of ownership, we are RESPONSIBLE to provide the best home to bettas, and any other animals, we own. It is *clearly* irresponsible to put a living creature into an environment that provides no stimulation, no sense of security, which will inevitably become dirty and foul, which will foster disease, which will result in unhealthy living conditions and end in death or severe unhappiness. By providing these simple things for an animal, then we have met the requirements for responsibility, and the creatures in our care are happy and comfortable.

Furthermore, these pets have never known "freedom" and can only experience what we provide them with. It is not as if we are imprisioning them after they have known a life outside of an aquarium...we are only providing them with what they have known and are happy with, or, many times, something better. I know that my petstore betta-mill rescue bettas have never known the joys of live plants, 10 gallons to swim in, other bettas which they are safely allowed to interact with, not to mention quality food and care. My bettas currently have the best possible life, and I would definitely bet the best living conditions they have ever known. I very much doubt they would trade their clean, safe, cycled tanks for a life of fear and inevitable death in a "wild" environment they are not genetically capable of dealing with.

Furthermore, I disagree with the opinion that properly set up aquariums are just "less extreme versions" of what is being posted here. In the same way that we understand it to be wrong to keep a dog locked in a bathroom for their entire life, we should also be fully capable of understanding that locking a fish in an equivalent container is also wrong! My dogs have free reign of a 2500 sq ft home, an acre of fenced in yard, they receive walks of an hour or more daily, and frequent trips to go hiking, to parks, to other neighborhoods, etc. There is no comparison between the "extreme" home of a puppy mill dog living in a wire crate to what my dogs experience on a daily basis. The same goes for my bettas. My boys who live in cycled, heavily covered, heated, 10g tanks are not comparable to the fish living in the circle bowl of doom pictured here a few times.
Wild or not, they're still living creatures. And we're still taking these fish away of their natural homes (I would imagine against their will) and forcing them to live where they might not want to live. It's no different than being kidnapped by a really nice kidnapper, that just happens to feed you well and clean the room you're forced to stay in.

Look, I'm a proud fish owner, the same as the next guy here... And I'm definitely not some left wing hippie activist either, lol. I'm just bringing up a counter viewpoint to balance this thread out a little. It's good old wholesome debate :D

Last edited by ryancalif; 05-04-2013 at 09:27 AM.
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Old 05-04-2013, 11:46 AM   #105 
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Wild or not, they're still living creatures. And we're still taking these fish away of their natural homes (I would imagine against their will) and forcing them to live where they might not want to live. It's no different than being kidnapped by a really nice kidnapper, that just happens to feed you well and clean the room you're forced to stay in.

Look, I'm a proud fish owner, the same as the next guy here... And I'm definitely not some left wing hippie activist either, lol. I'm just bringing up a counter viewpoint to balance this thread out a little. It's good old wholesome debate :D
The thing is, Betta Splendens is NOT a wild type Betta. You will never find a Delta Tail or HM in the wild. Their fins would be impractical in the wild. They were bred to be captive animals, just like any domesticated dog or cat. We are not "forcing" them to live in tanks. It's the life that this particular species has always lived. Releasing them into the wild would be cruelty.
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Old 05-04-2013, 04:16 PM   #106 
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The thing is, Betta Splendens is NOT a wild type Betta. You will never find a Delta Tail or HM in the wild. Their fins would be impractical in the wild. They were bred to be captive animals, just like any domesticated dog or cat. We are not "forcing" them to live in tanks. It's the life that this particular species has always lived. Releasing them into the wild would be cruelty.

I have to agree with Shiver...most (most, not all) of the animals commonly kept as pets have been so long domesticated that it would be cruel to release them into the wild.
I can't imagine any of my ferrets being able to hunt for themselves...they would die in merely days.
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Old 05-08-2013, 01:46 PM   #107 
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I have to agree with Shiver...most (most, not all) of the animals commonly kept as pets have been so long domesticated that it would be cruel to release them into the wild.
I can't imagine any of my ferrets being able to hunt for themselves...they would die in merely days.
Heck, I can't get rid of my cat for nothing (kidding, he's just exasperating sometimes). He'll get out and come back all "MEOWMEOWMEOWMEOWMEOW" till we let him in and he's cold and shaking and heads straight for the food bowl. Natural predator? Maybe. Too domesticated to just toss out on his butt. lol
And seeing as betta splendens were bred in captivity, there's no way to recreate a "natural" habitat, they've never been in nature. We can give them habitats mimicking their cousin fish, but never their own.
But recreating nature doesn't matter. All that needs to be done is to give them their needs (Shelter, food, enough water, so on so forth). A betta could do well in a small jar, whereas another would not. But if kept in something small, water must be changed accordingly. Now, don't take this the wrong way, I'd never tell someone to keep their betta in a cup, or anything under like 2 gallons. But that's how I am. It possible and plausible, not necessarily cruel so long as it's done right, but I'd never do, nor would I tell another to do it.
But yes, point of rambling, there is not technically a natural habitat for betta splendens, we kinda just make that bit up all on our own, seeing as they are not, nor ever were, a wild subspecies. xD
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Old 05-08-2013, 05:56 PM   #108 
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Said like a boss, SamJustice. Said like a boss.
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Old 05-08-2013, 06:50 PM   #109 
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I have to say I was guilty of crimes against betas when I first got mine. I had him in a vase with a moss ball that was torn and flattened to cover the bottom. I still have the setup, but it is strictly home to my bamboo now. He was not full size, so it was alright for the three days he was in there. He now has a 2.5 gallon while I set up and divide my 5 gallon. At that point I will move my baby girl from her one gallon hospital/ quarantine tank to his old 2.5 for the summer, then I'm thinking of starting a sorority in my 30 gallon.

As for horrible tanks, this one was on "Does it work" (A news segment testing advertised products) It was given the Go-ahead, and it's not small, but it needs more surface area for the water to aerate.


Here is a link to the video of their testing of it.
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Old 05-08-2013, 07:36 PM   #110 
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Here is a link to the video of their testing of it.
But... What's the point? Why would you want to put a fish inside of a clock? It's completely blank inside, no room for plants of gravel because if would obstruct the view. That plus the arms could tear the fins.
As well, in the video the woman says "bay-ta" rather than the proper pronunciation, "Beh-ta," and even goes as far to say that they're "easy to care for."
Sure they are, if you don't know how to do it. There really is no such thing as an animal that is easy to care for. Every creature has basic and complex needs that have to be met in order to be considered humane.

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Originally Posted by crowntaillove3 View Post
These just make me sick:


Attachment 113250


They are 1/2 gallons and they are in the "Indulge, Pamper, and Spoil Your Pet" section. HOW IS THAT PAMPERING?!?!?!?!?!
To address this, I know it's not ideal for a Betta. However, my boyfriend kept one of his fish in it because when we started out, we didn't really know better. Upon moving him to a larger enclosure, said fish became lethargic and didn't eat. Moving him back to this tank perked him right up. He's also accompanied by a live plant, anchored into the trough in the center. As long as it's well maintained, a half gallon can be suitable for a fish (if it prefers it). Even fish have preferences.

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