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Old 01-26-2012, 11:21 AM   #1 
freesia
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ich? fin rot? columnaris? or fungus?

Housing
What size is your tank? 10 gal.
What temperature is your tank? 80F
Does your tank have a filter? Yes
Does your tank have an air stone or other type of aeration? No
Is your tank heated? Yes
What tank mates does your betta fish live with? He is only one

Food
What type of food do you feed your betta fish? Nutrafin Max Betta Color enhancing flakes, Betta Food Daily Nutrition for all bettas
How often do you feed your betta fish? 2x in the morning 2 flakes and in the evening 2 pellets

Maintenance
How often do you perform a water change? Every day - 30%
What percentage of the water do you change when you perform a water change? 30%
What type of additives do you add to the water when you perform a water change? Aqueon Water Conditioner

Water Parameters:
Have you tested your water? If so, what are the following parameters?


I run out of test strips today, so I tested only nitrite level that is 0
Ammonia:
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate:
pH:
Hardness:
Alkalinity:

Symptoms and Treatment
How has your betta fish's appearance changed? Answers below
How has your betta fish's behavior changed?
When did you start noticing the symptoms?
Have you started treating your fish? If so, how?
Does your fish have any history of being ill?
How old is your fish (approximately)? Bought him Dec.3, 2011

I bought him Dec 3, 2011. During first 2 weeks he lost part of his tail and ends of his tail got ragged. I put him on melafix for seven days. After that was no improvement. The tank was cycling, so I thought that nitrate and nitrite are to blame. I started water changes everyday 30%. No improvements with his tail and dorsal started to be a little wilted. I also notice small white dots on his pectoral fins. White spot/ ich? I didnít want to medicate him, because tank was still cycling. I added aquarium salt to tank. At low salinity level he was Ok and looked like he enjoyed the salt, but at 3 tsp. per gallon his behaviour change and was clearly seen that salt rather davasted him. So I stopped adding salt and for one week did only water changes every day 30%. He got worse. Besides white spot on pectorals, small 2 lumps appeared: one on his head and one on body, also small 2 holes on his upper fin, so I decide to medicated him. Because I thought that is ich I put Maracide on Monday. On Tuesday on his upper tip of tail white stuff appeared like fungus and upper fin got a lot worse. I looked at Mardel chart about fish diseases and the chart says to put Maracyn II for secondary infection, so I did it. Today he doesnít looked better. He looks worse. Ends of his ragged tail are white and on the upper tip of his tail is white stuff. The ends of his tail are like glue together. Ich? Columnaris? Fungus? Fin rot? How to cure him?
He is very energetic; swim a lots and eats very well. I partially change water every day Ė 30% and redose tank.
Any help will be much appreciated.

I will try to post pictures
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Old 01-26-2012, 12:01 PM   #2 
freesia
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I posted 3 photos:

http://photoshare.shaw.ca/view/12150265964-1327600365-77933/
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Old 01-26-2012, 01:25 PM   #3 
Oldfishlady
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Welcome to the forum and sorry you are having problems.....

Since he is otherwise acting and eating okay...it may be water movement and/or space that is causing the fin damage and then due to the opening of the tissue a secondary infection has set in as well....

What I would recommend-QT in a small container-bare bottom and start aquarium salt, tannins, water changes with good nutrition for 10 days...

If you bought him in one of those small temporary cups with a lid-these work great for QT and can be floated in the heated tank to maintain water temp in the 77-78F range-by QT'ing in a small bare container will also help to rule out environment as the cause. Be sure to attach the QT to the side of the tank so it doesn't sink or get knocked around by the filter.

Premix the treatment water in a 1gal jug of dechlorinated water-Add aquarium salt 2tsp/gal and a tannin source if you have one-either IAL or dried Oak leaf-let this steep for 30min and use this for 25% water changes every 15min for 1 hour today....he need to stay in this QT in the Tx water during the treatment period.

Tomorrow start 50% water changes with the premixed Tx water daily for 3 days-On day 4 make 100%...repeat this schedule for 10 days...3-50% and 1-100%

On day 11-make 25% daily water changes using fresh-like temp-dechlorinated water for 2 days-Make a 50% water change on the 10gal on day 3 and then start 25% water change using the tank water for 2 days to get him ready to go back in his tank

Once back in his tank-you may need to turn off the filter or remove it all together-sometimes the water movement can be the cause of fin damage on the long fin males.....water changes on a 10gal unfiltered without live plants-50% weekly with vacuum and 100% monthly.

Nutrition-good quality varied diet fed in small frequent meals and if you have access to mosquito larva-offer several rinsed for one meal a day.
Nutrition is the building blocks for good health, fin regrowth, healing and a strong immune response.....

If you have something organic in the 10gal filtered tank-like shrimp, snails, live plants...they should hold/continue the nitrogen cycle while the Betta is in QT for treatment...but if you decide to remove the filter it is going to limit the stability of the nitrogen cycle anyway
IMO/E-filters are optional for this species and often the cause of fin damage-especially for the long heavy fin males-some can have more delicate fins than other.....

Depending on the amount of damage, genetic, age...etc.....healing time can vary...you should start to see new growth at the tips (usually white/clear in color) by day 4-5...full regrowth can take weeks to months and sometimes the fins never look the same or return to their full glory...this can vary for Betta to Betta....

If he has any changes in behavior or signs/symptoms let us know...

Keep us posted...nice looking Betta by the way...nice find....
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Old 01-26-2012, 02:34 PM   #4 
freesia
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Thank you for your fast reply. I want to ask two questions to make sure I will do it wright way
1. Can I break current treatment with MaracynII right now? (I think about bacteria resistance)
2. reg. tannin source - what is IAL? Can I buy AIL and dried Oak leaf in Pet smart?
3. Can I move him from tank to QT with fish net without acclimatization?
Thank you
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Old 01-26-2012, 02:47 PM   #5 
Oldfishlady
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I would complete the course on the antibiotic before you start the treatment I recommended....

IAL or Indian almond leaf-usually you have to order this on-line
Dried Oak leaf-if you have any oak trees pesticide free-collect 18-20 naturally dried and fallen from the tree Oak leaf-crush and add to the premixed treatment water-this is what I use....

When you cup for QT you will start with the tank water-then by using the premixed treatment water and making the 25% water changes every 15min for 1 hour will acclimate him to the treatment water...
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Old 01-26-2012, 02:54 PM   #6 
freesia
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Thank you for the explanations and I will do this
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Old 01-26-2012, 08:09 PM   #7 
Karebear13
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Hi sorry I am new and Dont know how to post my own thing... I was wondering if my betta has ICh... I noticed a little speck on his head http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr....gdQuvwYXUC4%3D

this is the only one he has, Should i wait to treat it or what should I do.... How do I treat ich
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Old 01-31-2012, 09:18 AM   #8 
freesia
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I finished the treatment with Maracyn II and Maracide. During this treatment I did water changes 30% everyday, re-dosed for water taken out and put new dosage. His tail looked the same like it was when I started give him maracyn II. Dorsal fin looked much worse. I moved him yesterday evening to quarantine tank with salt as Oldfishlady recommended. I added some Indian almond leaf to his treatment water, but not much because I could get only some crumbs. I was afraid to put oak leaves, because I am from Vancouver area, (Canada) and in winter time itís raining 24/7, so there is a lot of mould here. The Tank temp is 78F. Today morning his fins look horrible. The upper fin is dry on all length, ragged and tail more rugged and white, the cotton stuff spread. It spreads very fast... I feel so badÖ Should I go with salt? antibiotics? Or salt with antibiotics? What to do?
I changed his nutrition. I read on forum that Hikari gold pellets are good, but I couldnít get them here. I bought Aqueon Betta Food and Topfin freeze-dried bloodworms. I was told in pet store to give him one day- 2 pellets two times and pinch of bloodworms, on second day only pellets: 3 in the morning and three in the evening. Will these food cover his protein nutrition or do I have to go somewhere farther and look for different food?
I attached picture but he lookd much worse in realty...
Thank you in advance for all suggestions/replays
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Old 01-31-2012, 09:34 AM   #9 
Oldfishlady
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I would increase the salt to 3tsp/gal and add enough of the tannin source to make the water a dark amber color...be sure and pre-mix the treatment water and make 50% water changes with it...is he still otherwise acting okay...and you are keeping him in the QT in the treatment water.... correct.....

Sometimes with multi products used back to back the fish can get toxic and you can also cause resistant issues as well.....

It can take several days before you see improvement....

A better pic would also help so that we can see the fins....
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Old 01-31-2012, 10:15 AM   #10 
freesia
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When I got first advice about treatment from you I remove everything from his main tank and completed antibiotic in bare tank. Yesterday I put him in 1 gal. quarantine bare tank inside the main tank. He eats and swims fine.
Reg. tannin: I donít have much because I took from this person everything what he had. Should I put everything what I have in to premixed water? I look for more, but I donít believe that I will get them fast. (Delivery time takes weeks). Will salt works without tannins?
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