Breeding for the consumer

[Amphibianite]

So I have been thinking on this for a little bit, and was wondering others people thoughts.

As breeders we have the duty that when breed, we do it to advance the species. strengthen fins, better coloring, scaling, etc.

So the questions are, how do we balance this duty with the need to provide the consumer the variety and amounts they need?

For example

So I have an LPS that wants me to supply them their bettas.
So here my line of thoughts.
As the supplier I will need to provide a them a steady stream of bettas. Which means I will need to breed at least once a month maybe twice a month. So this leads to other problems and questions.
As a breeder it is my duty to advance the species, and not breed bettas without a purpose, the colors, the fins, etc.
As a supplier I will need to provide variety. So I need to have a wide amount of breeders.
I need more types of bettas to breed. I have HMs, HMPKs, and CTs here.
Yet I feel I may need to breed VTs as well, lets face it the consumers want VTs
So as a breeder, how do I breed VTs rightly?
I do have a green double tail VT girl, so I could breed a line of DTVTs.
(I don't plan on jumping into an extreme breeding schedule right now. I will be breeding every two months to start with till I get the experience I need under my belt)

So what do you think? How do we breeders provide the consumers what they want, while holding up our end, and doing our proper duty to the fish?

Oh and so you know I personally understand that it is very hard to make a profit in breeding bettas. So others should realize this too.

[vilmarisv]

I think that is better to specialize in certain tail types rather than have more of lower quality. Even VTs are in every store that sells bettas but you cannot find a good quality VT.
If the lps you're planning to deal with ends up having good quality HMs, for example, it will be known for that. As far as color variety, go with a line that trows variety like multicolored and marbles.
How great would be to find a true HM female in an lps, or even an true HM.
I think you should concentrate more on your personal goals rather than what the store wants as you will be making little to no profit and a consumer who goes into a fish store to get a betta (and don't know what they are doing) will usually leave with a betta no matter what the store offers because they don't understand the varieties out there.

[Amphibianite]

That is my point exactly is our duty are breeders is to have that quality in our stock. So if we need to provide bettas to a store, then shouldnt they be the absolute best quality they can be, and by that be advancing the species.
Such as if I decide to breed VTs I will not be breeding regular VTs but developing my own line of double tails.

I just want to mention the store is not putting any demands or request on me just happy to take what I breed.

[vilmarisv]

DO you know you can't work DTs exclusively?
Dt + Dt will give you Dts but a lot of problems will come along because you will posibly get a lot of deformed fish.
I've heard people wanting to work on VTs throught the years but never seen it progress too much. It would be nice to see where you can take them.

[Amphibianite]

Yes I am aware of that fact. I have a DTHM boy who is recovering something that wrecked him. Gave him horrid SBD and took almost all his fins. I am hoping he recovers fully. After two months or so he is finally on the path to recovery.

Lately I have seen some stunning VTs coming into my area. so if I can develop a line of DTs to start with, then fold in new colors and such I should have a few lines I can work with.

[MrVampire181]

VTs are difficult because of mass pond breeding. It would take a lot of work. This summer I will be working with two other breeders on a line of red VTs (favorite of mine) to see how it would work out.

[Amphibianite]

I wish you luck on that MV.

I fully understand VTs are the big pond fish farmed fish. Which is why i am hoping being the possible sole supplier to this LPS I maybe able to show some true quality in my area.
I admit I am a new breeder with big plans, but I know I need to take it slow to begin with and get the experience I need under my belt first.

[bettalover2033]

@Amphibianite: Now I can't say that I support the supplying to pet stores since all of the horrid stories and personal experience I have had with them, but as a breeder, I would say that the way you are taking this is very well thought out and I think in time you will be prepared with a decision. Personally I think you should focus on a variety type as VM said. Try marbles since they are all different and never have the same pattern. I have an amazing LPS near me and he is the owner of the tiny little place so I can definitely sell them to him if I would like, but haven't really thought about it yet. I spoke to him about HMPK and PKs and he didnt even know what they were. Little did he know what HMs were.

I think if I can get him while he isn't too busy with customers and cleaning ect, I can explain to him so,e varieties. He is still the stereotype that thinks all short finned bettas are females.

Anyway, to get back to my point, I want to say that this sounds like a great idea and I would love to hear about how you go about doing this. You are a role model to new breeders everywhere.

I wish I had started like you( being so prepared ).

[Amphibianite]

BL2033 - I will make this quick because I woke up, checked the forums and am replying haha. I really shouldn't even be awake let alone conscious enough to form a reply.

I only supply to mom and pop stores that I have checked out and know they will take care of my bettas. I refuse to sell and supply to say walmart or petco. So taking the time to talk to the owners myself and assuring myself that they have the knowledge to care for and supply the consumer with the proper information.
I will be taking a step in that direction as well by when I supply the fish I will have labels for each such as. Male Halfmoon Plakad. Female Delta. Female CrownTail. Male Veiltail.
sort of like what petco does.
Along with this I will be creating a proper care and treatment sheet to go with the bettas. So that when people look at my fish they will see what they need to truly take care of them.
I will of course be putting this site on the sheet for under more information please see www.bettafish.com
etc.

As well as the LPS who is excited and really wants me to be their supplier is one I frequent for my live foods for my other animals. Crickets for my toads, mice for my snake. So I will be in their often to check on things,.
The place just was sold and is under new management but already I have a decent relationship with the new owner.

Now I am going to pass out again, because I should be sound asleep.

[bettalover2033]

Originally Posted by Amphibianite

BL2033 - I will make this quick because I woke up, checked the forums and am replying haha. I really shouldn't even be awake let alone conscious enough to form a reply.

I only supply to mom and pop stores that I have checked out and know they will take care of my bettas. I refuse to sell and supply to say walmart or petco. So taking the time to talk to the owners myself and assuring myself that they have the knowledge to care for and supply the consumer with the proper information.
I will be taking a step in that direction as well by when I supply the fish I will have labels for each such as. Male Halfmoon Plakad. Female Delta. Female CrownTail. Male Veiltail.
sort of like what petco does.
Along with this I will be creating a proper care and treatment sheet to go with the bettas. So that when people look at my fish they will see what they need to truly take care of them.
I will of course be putting this site on the sheet for under more information please see www.bettafish.com
etc.

As well as the LPS who is excited and really wants me to be their supplier is one I frequent for my live foods for my other animals. Crickets for my toads, mice for my snake. So I will be in their often to check on things,.
The place just was sold and is under new management but already I have a decent relationship with the new owner.

Now I am going to pass out again, because I should be sound asleep.

Everything you have stated I have done besides the actual selling to my LPS. So what I am trying to do is really study the LPS and see if I would be making a good choice. I have developed a really good relationship with my LPS as well since I used to go there every day for months. I did ask him is he would let me sell my bettas to him and he said yes, but that was quite a few years ago and I don't know if he will remember. So what I think I'm going to do is see if I can still possibly sell him my fry.

Since he doesn't know what HMPKs and PKs are I will have to give care sheets and explain to him that all short finned bettas are not females and can be males as well and how to really be able to tell male from female.

I see that he takes really good care of his fish and has opened up that tiny store in the 60s. I'm sure he knows how to take care of them, but I am afraid of the people that come in. I saw him get a shipment of bettas once and he had payed them on the table near the cash register and kids came in and shook the bags when he was fetching something for them. I told them not to do it again and he told them to leave.

Anyway sorry for the rambling. I might just breed cts for him since I'm not too fond of VTs. Though I do admire their colors and lately have seen some really nice fins on them so I might reconsider later down the line.