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Old 02-20-2013, 05:37 PM   #601 
Granberry
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Oops, my bad. It's the Fila something that was bred to chase slaves.

Fishy, you have added a lot of emotion and opinion to the conversation, but very little fact. I can't help but list facts (lawyer, occupational hazard). I've tried to recommend using breed clubs to handle the problem and given examples where that was successful, using stricter licensing requirements and given examples of where that's done and what it requires, giving you multiple suggestions for ways you could channel your passion and maybe make a difference for the entire breed.

This is the way it always goes. Pit bull owners respond with things like "don't ban dogs, ban stupid people" as if there's any way that could be done. They say, "My baby loves my pit" and say that if a pit bull pulled off someone else's baby's arm, it's due to poor parenting.

We can't legislate against stupidity, and we cannot argue with stupid people, but we can legislate about property that can and cannot be owned. And we are, and we will continue.
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Old 02-20-2013, 05:58 PM   #602 
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Originally Posted by Granberry View Post
I can't help but list facts
And yet you've referred to the "AKC standard" for pit bulls at least twice! You might want to double check your 'facts', especially on which registering bodies recognize the American Pit Bull Terrier.

This thread is full of lulz!
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:05 PM   #603 
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AMERICAN PIT BULL TERRIER
Official UKC Breed Standard
Revised December 1, 2012
(text about appearance, etc deleted. Text about "disqualifying faults"-which don't include aggression BTW- also deleted)
Note: Although some level of dog aggression is characteristic of this breed, handlers will be expected to comply with UKC policy regarding dog temperament at UKC events

EDITED TO ADD: I could look up the AKC and other UKC standards for all of the other dogs considered pit bulls but I'm bored of this conversation by now and am going to go feed my fish
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:12 PM   #604 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Granberry View Post
Oops, my bad. It's the Fila something that was bred to chase slaves.

Fishy, you have added a lot of emotion and opinion to the conversation, but very little fact. I can't help but list facts (lawyer, occupational hazard). I've tried to recommend using breed clubs to handle the problem and given examples where that was successful, using stricter licensing requirements and given examples of where that's done and what it requires, giving you multiple suggestions for ways you could channel your passion and maybe make a difference for the entire breed.

This is the way it always goes. Pit bull owners respond with things like "don't ban dogs, ban stupid people" as if there's any way that could be done. They say, "My baby loves my pit" and say that if a pit bull pulled off someone else's baby's arm, it's due to poor parenting.

We can't legislate against stupidity, and we cannot argue with stupid people, but we can legislate about property that can and cannot be owned. And we are, and we will continue.
Do you own a dog?

Can I ask what happened if you were a responsible pet owner who had dog that was dearly beloved by you, but which was suddenly deemed to be a dangerous breed/colour/type?

What if the law was that any dog of your breed/colour/type had to be rounded up en masse and euthanised?

Would you find it easy to surrender up your beloved family pet to certain death because of idiots out there who never think of the possible wide-reaching consequences of their actions?

I'm sure you'd be angry, upset and heartbroken that this was allowed to happen.

BSL hurts a lot of innocent people. Pets aren't just property to most of us. They are a part of the family. It's not like this legislation involving the handing in of firearms. Pets are a huge part of many people's lives.

It's why pet owners have to be very cautious about what kind of laws are passed in regards to our pets.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:16 PM   #605 
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I think this thread all comes down to this:

Some people choose to kill things to fix their problems. Other people try to nurture and motivate those things to try and fix the problem. We all know which choice is easiest and has the most solid outcome: killing. Therefore, as humans, most of us choose to kill. If you believe in evolution (which I do), you will see that primates in general are fairly violent mammals, especially chimpanzees. This is quite ironic considering we are killing animals for being just that, violent. I'm afraid we're all hypocrites :(

On the contrary, you really can't blame anyone for wanting to kill vicious dogs. I don't think targeting a breed is the way to go because it makes absolutely no sense at all, but we kill dogs for the same reason dogs bite or kill humans: they feel threatened, anxious or dominant.

Last edited by Viva; 02-20-2013 at 06:18 PM.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:29 PM   #606 
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Guys, no reasonable BSL would "round up pit bulls and euthanize them".

In the UK, the law was that all pit bull type dogs had to be registered with a certain agency and be neutered and to be tagged. Those dogs were free to live their lives with their families. No breeding. When they died, the end. It wasn't a fast solution, but it was reasonable. It is the kind of solution we could come up with if Pit Bull owners weren't so stubborn and emotional.

BTW, I have 3 dogs, a pug, pomeranian and Cavalier King Charles. Prior to that, I had a pug and a Rottweiler. I loved the Rottweiler more than any of them. But my toddler dropped a piece of cheese and my dog reached for it the same time my son did. My dog defied his training. He was trained (formal obedience and daily work) to step back and sit. Instead he barked a warning bark, showed his teeth, and got the cheese. We put him down the next day and we all cried for a month, but it was what was the message the Rottweiler Breed Club was putting out. I was very active with in the AOL online forums, and everyone agreed - not one person dissented.. I remember one person who I didn't even like actually said to me "Your dog showed aggression towards your baby. How could you responsibly tolerate that?" I was devastated that he, in his old age, got cranky, but we don't risk that stuff in my house.

Last edited by Granberry; 02-20-2013 at 06:34 PM.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:43 PM   #607 
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Sometimes it takes being directly affected by an issue like this to understand us """stubborn and emotional""" pit bull owners...
Point is some people just don't care because it doesn't affect their own animals...
I defend any breed that is being attacked, this sort of thing has affected many breeds Over the years and I'm sure shortly there will be yet another breed in the same position as ours is today....

In short there is a reason pit bulls are hated... Because people don't understand that everything is individual. This doesn't account for just dog breeds, it goes to human races, origins and beyond things like that.

A dog is like a painting and the owner is like the painter... The painter helps the painting develop and is responsible for the way it turns out..
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:44 PM   #608 
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Granberry, you're wrong yet again. Go and search up BSL type laws that were put into act in the UK. Didn't you here about Lennox? Everyone heard about him. BSL took him and killed him because he looked like a pit bull. Yet even genetic tests SHOWED he was far from it.

ETA: Heres a US Documentary about a BSL type law in several states
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2vtmAwcCn8
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:48 PM   #609 
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Pretty sure that in Victoria here in Australia our rules in regards to dog aggression are ridiculously strict.

There have been a couple of court cases recently where dogs were seized by councils because they had some physical characteristics of a 'dangerous breed' but had to then be returned to their owners by an order of the Supreme Court because it couldn't be proven that those dogs were indeed pitbulls.

That's why I am so against BSL. If my dad's dog ever got out of his yard he could be impounded and possibly euthanised as he looks very much like the kind of dog they have been targeting and I think his previous owners had him listed as a pitbull cross (we adopted him from the RSPCA).

Local councils are incompetent at the best of times, and the amount of stupidity that has been going on with dogs in our state is ridiculous.

Don't know what it is like in the states, but a lot of dog people, pet owners and breeders alike are quite worried about the direction laws relating to dogs are heading in.
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Old 02-20-2013, 06:50 PM   #610 
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Guys, no reasonable BSL would "round up pit bulls and euthanize them".
Really? Google Denver Pitbull Massacre. (I'm sure the photos wouldn't be allowed here.)
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