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Old 04-22-2012, 08:57 PM   #31 
LittleBettaFish
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I have wild-caught bettas. They live in a biotope-style tank of 10 gallons, with a pH of less than 5 and lots and lots of moss and leaf litter to provide appropriate cover.

It took them a month for me to get them used to me. In their first year they bred continuously every two weeks. Now they have 4 juveniles and 1 adult offspring in with them. They take pellets, live and frozen and are exceptionally tame.

They have also grown bigger than the average size given for their species.

I would assume the process of going through shipping and capture was stressful, as was the first month or so of living with me.

However, by providing an ideal environment from the first day, I have fish that are probably happier and healthier than their wild counterparts. There is no dry season, no lack of food, no predation, and no competition for territory or mating rights.

Mother nature is not very kind to animals. Out in the wild the environment is not adapted for the fish, the fish adapt to their environment. Death is usually not very nice and there's no one sitting there making sure everyone gets the right amount of food and treatment if they get sick or injured.

This is the difference between 'pet' fish and wild fish. There are very very few species (usually saltwater) that will not thrive just as well, if not better in an appropriate aquarium than they would in the wild. The key is in the word appropriate. Except during drought or dry season there's no species of fish that would live permanently in only 4L of water. It is not a sustainable 'real life' model.
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:06 PM   #32 
ao
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Well, I've had most of these fish for a while, and I believe they are inifinitely happier than they were in the pet shop and many have healed up, the corys have grown out their barbels and the ottos have developed a much rounder stomach as oppose to their original emaciated selves. :) Thats my definition of giving them a better space to live in. You have your definition and I respect that :)I also completely agree with what you are saying. I apologize for the fact that my standard doesnt meet most people's out there. But as long as they keep growing healthily and don't get sick, I am quite satisfied. :D
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:10 PM   #33 
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As long as my puppy is growing fine in a small crate with enough food/water and cleaning, and is able to stand up and turn around, I don't care if she's all by herself or doesn't have room to excessive her guts out. Dogs don't need socialization, that's just wild wolves that do that!!

>_< harsh side of me.
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:15 PM   #34 
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Lol, I might think about that if I kept fish in just enough water to turn around in. :)

by the way, I looked up the phermone information. Growth stunting usually happens amongst same species fish. But I'm going to do some periodical water changes and see how that affects the system.
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:16 PM   #35 
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Please guys, let's not turn this into an arguement and try and help the OP. What's done is done.
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:17 PM   #36 
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Sorry DQ.
About the stunting- he is a betta, and he himself is releasing betta stunting hormone. That's the problem. He's not affecting the other fish with it. :)
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:21 PM   #37 
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I can see this is going to go no where. The OP clearly has their mind set, at the expense of their fish. Any living creature you choose to bring into your home is deserving of proper care. Your standard goes against everything the experts recommend. Do some research on your species and learn about properly stocking tanks.

Time for me to take my leave in this thread, it is giving me a headache.
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:25 PM   #38 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luimeril View Post
no offense, but that's a PETA argument. :I domestic bettas like the ones we keep, were created by HUMANS. they cant' survive in teh wild like their wild relatives can, so there's no place to 'throw them back' to. that argument, imo, is selfish. i keep my bettas, for them. many of them would have been in situations far worse than i'd ever provide, shoved in vases, jars, cups, bottles, instead of the 1-3 gallon tanks they live in now, which is the smallest i'd EVER keep a betta in. they are kept alone, which is what bettas want(they're extremely territorial fish), get the best food i can provide, get water changes every few days, have plenty of plants to swim through and sleep in. your jar without the other fish, would be fine for ONE fish, ONE betta, and no more. you saw, in the video, how active those wild cory catfish are. all the fish you crammed in that jar are very active fish, and are unhappy in that tiny little jar. i'd NEVER put any of those fish, save the betta by itself, in anything smaller than a 10 gallon tank. that many fish may be fine for a 20 gallon, or bigger, but not a one gallon jar with limited places for them to swim in.
+1 And now I am starting because you seem very ignorant, blunt yes, sorry

Most fish today are not even wild caught, humans have also breed the fish so they are more appealing, so if you do throw them in the wild they will not survive because they will make easy prey. Every see a fish that has really long fins like a veil tail or halfmoon in the wild? Of course not, it won't survive in the wild.

Just because you throw some plants in a tank, that doesn't mean you can keep any type of fish in the jar and say they are thriving. Your stocking would be close to the limits of a 10 gallon, and you have 1/10 the space! I feel like you never did read up on any of the fish as most of them require bigger tanks and more of their own species. What makes YOU think it is right to jeep all the fish in that jar?

End rant...
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:27 PM   #39 
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I figured that much at about page 2 :) it's in his own place right now with a large IAL leaf and java fern. Im going to move it to a 2 Gal tomorrow so it can be heated. Going to also procure some BBS too tomorrow, but I'll try frozen daphnia for now.

And I was reading ur gardening page olympia, you ever thought about trying cast iron plants for the shady area? I remember them being extremely hardy in my garden when I was small. they grew in the gap between the wall of our house and our neightbours. we never watered them or fertilized them and they are still there today, all nuce and green
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Old 04-22-2012, 09:32 PM   #40 
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Originally Posted by kfryman View Post
+1 And now I am starting because you seem very ignorant, blunt yes, sorry

Most fish today are not even wild caught, humans have also breed the fish so they are more appealing, so if you do throw them in the wild they will not survive because they will make easy prey. Every see a fish that has really long fins like a veil tail or halrfmoon in the wild? Of course not, it won't survive in the wild.

Just because you throw some plants in a tank, that doesn't mean you can keep any type of fish in the jar and say they are thriving. Your stocking would be close to the limits of a 10 gallon, and you have 1/10 the space! I feel like you never did read up on any of the fish as most of them require bigger tanks and more of their own species. What makes YOU think it is right to jeep all the fish in that jar?

End rant...
Hahaha thank you :)
in fact i've read up on all the fish I have in my tanks. The otos and corys are schooling fish usually kept in groups of 6. Endlers can pretty much tolerate any decent water condition, breed like rabbits and is best kept at a lower male : female ration or the females will be harassed. otos thrive well on algae and a constant supply is being provided. The sand substrate is primarily for the cories to be gentler on their barbels.

But, I understand your point :) And thank you for sharing.

may be I will be breeding the next generation of non schooling betta equivilant cat fish

Last edited by ao; 04-22-2012 at 09:34 PM.
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