Do you think he is a show quality giant? - Betta Fish and Betta Fish Care
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-28-2016, 11:59 PM Thread Starter
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Do you think he is a show quality giant?

Hi! This is my lovely boy, George. He's suppose to be a giant, but he's less than 6 cm :/
Small as he is, he's got spunk :D
Do you think he could be a show quality betta?

Oh and could you please tell me what color he actually is? The breeder just kept saying "he's a fancy boy".

Thanks again!
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 10:53 AM
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This guy isn't too bad and may prodyce shiw quality fryvif paired to the right female.

Thoughtbit could be better, his body is average. An ideal body should have equal top and bottom if you draw a line from mouth to tail.

Look at the last picture ; though front dorsal rays are short, the dorsal almost forms a half circle - which is not perfect but acceptable. A perfect dorsal should have long ftont rays leaning forward.

First pictures clearly shows he has at least 4 rays, some more. And it spreads 180*. An ideal caudal should have equal ray branching, whether 4, 8, or more. Never ther less it's good enough to produce good looking fry.

Anal looks to carry long fin genes. See how the bottom line curves downward. Short tails should have straight bottom line anals. And slghtly longer frint rays. But paired to the right female, fix that.

There are 3 PK show classes - tradituonal, assymmetrical, and symmetrical. Each have it's own criteria. Your guy could be bred towards the assymmetrical group.
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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 06:03 PM Thread Starter
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His ventrals dont "come down" when he flares, is that a fault?

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First pictures clearly shows he has at least 4 rays, some more. And it spreads 180*. An ideal caudal should have equal ray branching, whether 4, 8, or more. Never ther less it's good enough to produce good looking fry.
Are rays the branching things on the tail? And how would you count them?

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Anal looks to carry long fin genes. See how the bottom line curves downward. Short tails should have straight bottom line anals. And slghtly longer frint rays. But paired to the right female, fix that.
So what are all the qualities the female should possess? To get show quality fry?
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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 10-31-2016, 10:07 PM
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During attack - when they approach and flare, often ventals and dorsal will "close". When in "defense" or when they hold their ground both dorsal and vents will open. . . . The best time to snap pictures.

By rays, we mean the bone structure of fins. It starts with (often) 11 rays, each branching into two, then can branch again into two each. When we talk about very ray number, we are refering to the last number of rays/branching from one initial ray. In time, when you've seen enough rays, you'd get a pretty good idea of what 4 or 8 rays look like and thus can guess non clear pictures.

_20161101_094712.JPG

Though the picture isn't clear, notice the shape of the end rays arent the same. The third from the top is wider than the others. The shape alone indicates they are at least 4 rays. The third from the top might be more.

Female's quality should be the same as male's. But you may never find a perfect female for sale. Heck, even perfect males are hard to find. Breeders will only sell second best to worst and some breeders will never sell his females. You must train your eyes to spot fairly good form - balanced body (no spoon head), same length fins (mainly for long fin), at least dorsals that open like a fan or a half circle/oval. . . . Keep looking at as many pictures as you can find and compare. Look at VT pictures to see "bad form" (VT fin form is unaccepted in modern form shows - HM).
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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-01-2016, 06:04 AM Thread Starter
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Thank you!
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-01-2016, 09:00 AM
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He looks like an asymmetrical HMPK Giant to me? I thought Asymmetrical HMPK it is ok for the anal to slant a little, though the edges should meet the caudal and ventrals should match the length of the longest point.

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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-01-2016, 02:12 PM
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During attack - when they approach and flare, often ventals and dorsal will "close". When in "defense" or when they hold their ground both dorsal and vents will open. . . . The best time to snap pictures.

By rays, we mean the bone structure of fins. It starts with (often) 11 rays, each branching into two, then can branch again into two each. When we talk about very ray number, we are refering to the last number of rays/branching from one initial ray. In time, when you've seen enough rays, you'd get a pretty good idea of what 4 or 8 rays look like and thus can guess non clear pictures.

_20161102_020511.JPG
Ok, I figured out how to zoom.
Amanda, notice the bone structure on the fins, namely the caudal. From the top: 2-4-6-5-4-4-4 etc. That's what we mean when talking about rays.

Bettastarter:
Notice the bottom line of the anal is curved down. This is a HM (long fin) trait. It should be straight.
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-04-2016, 08:03 AM Thread Starter
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This guy isn't too bad and may prodyce shiw quality fryvif paired to the right female.
If the female I paired him too is a normal sized female? Would it affect the fry quality/conformation someway somehow?
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-05-2016, 02:11 AM
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No. Giants x regulars will effect size - probably all regulars with giant appetite. If you keep breeding the biggest ones, you should return them to giants around 4-6 generations.

Form depends on the parent's form. I truly believe that most fry will inherit more of mom's fins than dad's. But this isn't always true. In any case, it's always a good idea to use as good a quality as you could find.

It's harder to find good formed females than males. You can consider buying if you cone across :
- balanced shaped body. Fairly equal upper and bottom half if you draw a horizontal line in the middle
- smooth and aligned scaling with no gaps between scales
- half circle or oval shaped dorsal, specially if it has a long/tall front ray
-"D" shaped caudal (or close) with at least 4 rays. Early branching (split near the base - not the end) is better because it ensures better spread.
- balanced anal - according to fin type. Front ray leaning forward is better.
- all 3 fins meet/overlap.
- blade shaped ventrals. No extended ray nor splitting.

Females with these form can produce nice fry. And paired to a superbly formed male, can produce show form.
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 11-05-2016, 09:02 AM Thread Starter
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Is it acceptable still if the female's anal slopes downwards (top pic)? Because I'm seeing that, females whose fins overlap tend to have sloped anals. Or would the ideal still be a straight line? (Bottom pic)

For the fin edges, they should be smooth and straight right? Not "jaggedy"? (By "jaggedy" I mean like the top pic also)

Thanks again!
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