[MAP]

Hi

I'm the proud owner of a beautifull halfmoon male and have two halfmoon females I think he might be interested in.
Trouble is I can hardly define its colour (purple-greyish-rose fins with tiger like darker dots on the top fin).
On the other hand, one of the females is white (and vaguely blueisch marbeled?)
and the other some kind of yellow-transparant (except for some scales at the top)

.
Sorry for the bad photos they wouldnt stop begging for food
So the main question is: what do you think the colour of the spawn will be? Translucent greyish? Or can totaly unexpected colors comme from such a mix?

These are not from a well known breeder, just some fish I purchased at a local Tom&Co petshop. I do not know anything about their genetics. but then, the aim is just to breed for fun and for keeping at home, not to participate to show contest or anything. Nervertheless, I was just wondering if that could have an impact on the healt of eventual future younglings?

I have curently 2 tanks, one 16 gallon where the 2 females are, and one 5 gallon where the male lives together with some nano shrimps (which would be potential problems for the frey I guess?) I have a 3rd 5gallon tank I could start and cycle for some months with driftwood and soft sand and mossballs in case of need. What would you recommend me to do, 3rd tank or not ? And if so, with filter or not, or are air bubbles a better solution?

Many thanks!

 

[indjo]

Male is a copper - supposedly a metallic color line with steel blue base. I say supposedly because I'm not sure if your little guy is really metallic or cane from a dragon line.

Female 1: pastel type color. Looks to also be irid base. (Irid x cambodian line color)
Female 2: looks to have partial platinum scales. This also have cambodian lineage.

Possible color outcome;
Female 1 = cambodian line colors, irids (some might be metallic irids), copper, platinum (if lucky).
If the male is dragon scale, you should get similar pattern but more leaning to partial dragon scales

Female 2 = cambodian color line, irid, copper, platinum (probably bi or multi colored)

Pet store fish also came from breeders - your male looks to be from a show line.
You should produce healthy fry.

 

[MAP]

Male is a copper - supposedly a metallic color line with steel blue base. I say supposedly because I'm not sure if your little guy is really metallic or cane from a dragon line.

Female 1: pastel type color. Looks to also be irid base. (Irid x cambodian line color)
Female 2: looks to have partial platinum scales. This also have cambodian lineage.

Possible color outcome;
Female 1 = cambodian line colors, irids (some might be metallic irids), copper, platinum (if lucky).
If the male is dragon scale, you should get similar pattern but more leaning to partial dragon scales

Female 2 = cambodian color line, irid, copper, platinum (probably bi or multi colored)

Pet store fish also came from breeders - your male looks to be from a show line.
You should produce healthy fry.

Thanks so much indjo, you're amazing
For the male, have wanted to know since I have him and the word "copper" is just perfect to describe this little fella!
What do you mean by "a Showline"? For the little back story, he is a rescue from a petstore where they get bulk and treat ther fish horribly (poor maintained tanks with often dead fish, when I found him the filter was so hard he couldnt even swim away from the grid. When I have space available - my tanks are for aquascaping in the first place - I always try to save some "forgotten" fish. Didn't make a doubt I had to get him out of there.)

Anyway, he is a real scared one, even from the females. Tried to let him meet the Yelow female some time today and he was like "hell no, swim frantically away anywhere you can" even when she was not even close. Should I ever breed in the future, the white blue one will be less scaring him I believe (much less dominant).

 

[indjo]

You've definitely did a great job caring for the little rescue. He looks great.

By "Show line" ; I meant show breeding line
Your rose tail male has standard body, large leaning forward dorsal, balanced (equal length) fins, and wide ventrals - those are desired traits for shows

 

[MAP]

Thanks!

He has still a long way to go (lower fin still groing back from when another betta was tearing it apart).
He flares few and has trouble interacting (except for food) and is far less curious than other bettas I've known.
but we'll see where this one goes..... he might have been a marble some time because he has a slightly whiter patch on his back that isn't due to ilness or other so I think breeding him might just be interesting. But than again, he must first like the female fishes. As long as he is happy.....

 

[indjo]

Try to get them (both male and female) to flare. They don't have to flare against each other. You can flare them to other fish or even mirrors. Breeding is much easier if they are aggressive

Keep each solitary, hidden from each other. Only let them see each other/or mirror during flaring exercises.

 

[MAP]

Try to get them (both male and female) to flare. They don't have to flare against each other. You can flare them to other fish or even mirrors. Breeding is much easier if they are aggressive

Keep each solitary, hidden from each other. Only let them see each other/or mirror during flaring exercises.

Hi,
I have spend the afternoon to clean up some old transport tanks, and amongst stuff I rediscovered one small bowl (more the kind of glass half oval bowl you can use to see roots of plants in plant composition really, but big enough to not freak out one small betta) and....
what i'm thinking is I will scoop some water out of both aquariums, add a little extra clean water with JBL conditionning and a heater, ensure everything is perfect and than put one of the females in it next to the betta's tank. So they will be able to see and study each one without any harm done. And of course I will not put the female there for more than a couple of hours. just to see how its going and avoiding her being chased to death by the other female.
Meanwhile the other female is also to be put away for donation to a carefull owner but this can take a time...

 

[indjo]

Constant sight will make them uninterested. If you do keep female next to male's tank, be sure to card between them. Only remove card for flaring sessions.

 

[MAP]

Constant sight will make them uninterested. If you do keep female next to male's tank, be sure to card between them. Only remove card for flaring sessions.

I've let them see each other almost the whole afternoon before putting them back in their own tanks.
It was quite fun to see. The female was way more active compared to the male though.

 

[indjo]

Yes. Sometimes females are more aggressive and "take the lead". But as long as both show flirting behavior, they should breed.

By flirting behavior I mean;
Flaring aggressively, but swim all over their tanks then return to flare. Most males will make nests while females show light colored vertical lines at their midsection.

 

[MAP]

Yes. Sometimes females are more aggressive and "take the lead". But as long as both show flirting behavior, they should breed.

By flirting behavior I mean;
Flaring aggressively, but swim all over their tanks then return to flare. Most males will make nests while females show light colored vertical lines at their midsection.

The male had flirting behaviour in the sense he flared, then swam all over their tanks then return to flare. He didn't make any sign of making a nest though and today no nest as well; The female just went berserk against her tank glass.
The male betta is (in my understanding) still to scared to do anything else besides fleeing should the female be released in his tank I guess.

 

[indjo]

If they are showing full colors and flirting, you can release them (if they've been conditioned with nutritious foods for a week or two)

I'm not sure what you mean by "female going beserk". IMO, too aggressive individuals may seem going beserk. In this case, it would be good if they went beserk.

 

[MAP]

If they are showing full colors and flirting, you can release them (if they've been conditioned with nutritious foods for a week or two)

I'm not sure what you mean by "female going beserk". IMO, too aggressive individuals may seem going beserk. In this case, it would be good if they went beserk.

I released them both in my 16 gallon tank. Male went immediately hiding and seemed verry depressed while female went after him (trying to fin nip?) Theyre both back into their respective enclosure at the moment. The thing is I'm trying to figure a whole lot of things at the moment.

the betta's tank is a rescue tank (quarantine) since he himself is a rescue. Therefore there is no nutritient soil & sand nor plants, just some marino mossbals and a couple catappa leaves where my 5 shrimps are happy. I would like to rebrand its whole tank, idealiter when he is dating the female in the 16 gallon tank.... but then I am afraid even using the old filter and water from the other tank plus additives there will be a cycling process... doesn't seem optimal. I'm also afraid the blue velvet nano shrimps will attempt to eat possible eggs / frey if I transfer them to the 16 gallon too whilst cleaning....

Soooo I guess breeding is stuck at that point

 

[indjo]

Most people use new conditioned water in a bare tank. No substrate is needed, especially pebbles since egg may fall into the crevices.

And since you will have to do frequent water changing, you don't have to cycle the tank.

As for shrimps, some say they're safe, some say otherwise. To my experience, it depends on food supply. - if adequate, shrimp will not bother eggs/fry.

 

[MAP]

Most people use new conditioned water in a bare tank. No substrate is needed, especially pebbles since egg may fall into the crevices.

And since you will have to do frequent water changing, you don't have to cycle the tank.

As for shrimps, some say they're safe, some say otherwise. To my experience, it depends on food supply. - if adequate, shrimp will not bother eggs/fry.

Well, that s how I did it last time (for the whole story -> betta rescued from the store -> jumped tank (it didnt have a lid 2 months ago) into my 5-headed sorrority and I had unexpected eggs. Half were eaten by another female before I could figure a way to move the remaining ones in the betta's tank (with nothing). approx 5-10 fry existed but then became white and fell to the floor of the tank after 2 days. No idea why since the tank was clean, there were no shrimps at the time and I fed them special fry food....

 

[Feanor]

They might have just starved.
Betta fry will need tiny live food, close by, three days after free swimming, as they can‘t swim longer distances (Infusoria, Vinegar Eels, Baby Brine Shrimp).

That‘s why - if breeding with purpose - it‘s best to have a controlled environment, where you can watch the little ones and get food close to them.
They do not accept and won‘t eat any pellets or dust food.

 

[MAP]

They might have just starved.
Betta fry will need tiny live food, close by, three days after free swimming, as they can‘t swim longer distances (Infusoria, Vinegar Eels, Baby Brine Shrimp).

That‘s why - if breeding with purpose - it‘s best to have a controlled environment, where you can watch the little ones and get food close to them.
They do not accept and won‘t eat any pellets or dust food.

I had bought something in a vial that has to be kept in the fridge (so I suppose its alive) and then you put drops into the water.
those drops seem to dissolve but I've never seen them eat it or go towards it. Maybe too cold? I was wondering if an environement with mossballs can be good (as the moss is generaly ful of nutritients)?

 

[Feanor]

It is not live food.

Moss balls won‘t really add anything beneficial and also lay on the substrate.

A lot of floaters might work to provide some cover, hiding facility and also tiny micro organisms might stay there.

 

[indjo]

I agree with feanor that your fry might have starved to death. TBH, I don't really know what trigger them to eat, other than something tiny near them moving around.

I've seen similar products to the vial you described. To my knowledge, it's not live. It is supposed to create fry food (infusoria). Unfortunately I didn't find it as affective as using organic matter so I didn't continue using it

 

[MAP]

I agree with feanor that your fry might have starved to death. TBH, I don't really know what trigger them to eat, other than something tiny near them moving around.

I've seen similar products to the vial you described. To my knowledge, it's not live. It is supposed to create fry food (infusoria). Unfortunately I didn't find it as affective as using organic matter so I didn't continue using it

The only thing "live" the closest fishstore proposes are frozen bloodworms. These will obviously not do the trick....infusoria in a vial is the only thing I could find. @Feanor you mean floating plants like phyllantus?
Trouble here is the shrimps like those also