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Discussion Starter #42 (Edited)
Thanks Cheeky, Diesel.

Well still going ok this morning, he ate 5 pre soaked pellets. And it doesn't even impact on his tummy, normally when you feed a fish you can see it straight away. Although I don't think he is bloated at all. I think his coordination is better, but there is no signs of him having any buoyancy like a normal fish should have. I still want to hold off of the epsoms for a little longer, just to see if things start improving further on there own. If he was bloated I would start treatment, but really doesn't appear bloated at all.

There was a few pieces of fin in the tank today, it didn't look like rot and one piece was a bit clear. the rest black but opaque looking so really don't think he has rot of any kind, and his fins actually look ok. unless he took a mouthful of tail and spat it out. But I guess with constantly dragging himself across the floor. Plus all the changes lately it could be just bits of damage coming off. they were tiny 1 mm sort of size pieces. So I am not going to panic about that yet, if he was in a normal tank set up I wouldn't have even known.

I have done his water change, so all happy at the moment. He likes to either sit behind the heater, or rest on the thermometer which is now resting diagonally in the water, I couldn't read it above the water line because of condensation on the glass. I would like to put some things in there for him to rest on, but I am too worried he might get caught up on something and get stuck. so I will have to leave that for the time being. When he is next resting on the thermometer I will take a pic.
 

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Discussion Starter #43
Well he was sitting on the thermometer so got a good pic, looking at him I wonder if he is dragon scale, I know what the description of DS is supposed to be, but I still struggle to see the difference, he was not listed as one. Although our stores don't really label like that.
 

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Lir never appeared bloated. The epsom salts did wonders for him. If he is like Lir he may never be a good swimmer and may just be awkward. I would try raising the water level just a tiny bit and watching him for a bit. See if he can adjust to tiny raises in the water level/ He may have gotten his swim bladder damaged in shipment, and he's gotta let that heal and kinda learn to swim again. I'm almost positive that's what the case was with Lir. He was never bloated or anything like that. In fact, their symptoms seem to match very closely. (be warned, Lir became a vicious tail biter, as he swims so poorly, any current causes him to really chomp on his tail)
I think it's amazing that you took this guy on and he's done well so far!
 

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Discussion Starter #45
Thanks for the advise aselvarial. I have actually raised the level a little today. As like in the pic he seems to use the thermometer to his advantage. to get to the surface. I will raise it very gradual, I don't want to cause him too much stress trying to reach the surface. There is a bit more thermometer length to go that can be completely covered with water.
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Cool. How's he doing in the little more water?
Well he doesn't seem bothered with slightly more water just goes a bit higher on the thermometer. He doesn't really bother to try and move that much apart from when he wants to get air, or I disturb him.

Looks like he's doing better already! Keep up the great work, he's a gorgeous fish!
Yes Thankyou I think so too, when he first came home he kept wanting to sit lie body curled slightly, but when I think about it he was in a round tall tank that had a centre divider making a section halfmoon shaped, a betta each side. it must have only been a gallon tank at most divided for two. But he only really had a smooth curved glass wall to lean on, I wonder if he is now gradually uncurling as he seems to be straightening out more.

Maybe you could put some smooth, flattish rocks in there for him to lounge on? Just to give him more resting spots than the thermometer.

This was really kind of you. :)
Yes I am thinking along the same lines I was wondering if he might like a betta hammock. But I am also a little worried to add stuff in the bottom as he kind of needs a bit of speed and a run up before he gets lift off to surface if he is sat on the bottom. When sitting on the thermometer he just moves up slightly to surface and slides back down.
 

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Discussion Starter #51
Thanks polkadot.

I have given him his evening meal, frozen food not sure what it was, but he gobbled it down. This evening he was having a mad 5 minutes not in a bad way I think he was just trying to be a betta chasing his reflection around, although it looks funny when he is skimming across the bottom and on occasions gaining enough speed to go up the walls as much as he can, of course he came back down, but I think it wasn't quit as heavy as it has been. I think I will leave him be for a few more days just in case his condition as been caused by poor diet, poor water, maybe hardly no food, although he doesn't look underweight, but I think that is because he is so big and chunky if I really analyse him he should be fuller around the back end. And I also found some pellet coloured pieces on the bottom, which is possibly the pellet I am feeding so looks like things are starting to get moving. I would prefer not to have to use the epsoms if I can avoid it. But there are small improvements this evening, even in himself.
 

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Great work! Loving the updates, and as mentioned, he is absolutely stunning.
I would think he at least has dragon genes in him. But I'm bad at that seeing as the one fish I have is dragon and I didn't think so, and the one I thought might be "just had some dragon genes" and not full blown.

Beautiful either way, keep it up!
 

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I was thinking you really may want to put a floating cave in there. I have both the diy mesh caves, as well as well as the innards of a curler (weird huh?) in mine. The curler is just one of those plastic curlers with the stiff fuzzy stuff on the outside, with the fuzzy stuff ripped off and just the plastic bones left. It makes a perfect little floating cave for my fish that is a bad swimmer to rest in near the top. As you add water, he's going to need something near the top to rest on. :)

(I saw Lir sleeping in his and it reminded me that would be perfect for your guy)
 

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Discussion Starter #55
Thanks cheeky, KFoster.

I have decided this morning to start the epsoms. He has passed some small pellet coloured pieced, but I don't think it is enough to be considered all that he has been given. I prepared the change water and put the epsoms in the change water. I went over to the tank and thought he was floating some what. So then I thought perhaps I shouldn't treat with epsoms while debating he then went back to his side. And any signs of buoyancy gone so not sure if I imagined it or if perhaps he was sitting at an angle that just looked like he had buoyancy I don't know. I am adding the change water with the epsoms in 50% water changes with a 30 min wait that way it gives him a chance to accustom without it being a shock. I will do 3 50% changes and that should work out to a 100% water change as well as add the epsoms slowly.

At the moment because he is in such a small amount I am doing about 3 100% water changes a day, monitoring the water, easily within six hours I have a reading of .25 on the Ammonia, and I know I am using prime now so should be safe, it still unnerves me knowing the reading is there, and just have to change the water.

Some other good news there were no small pieces of fin floating around today, well there was one tiny piece, but noting I am going to be concerned with, he is bound to be getting his tail caught a little just because of the way he moves around. If I had come across another load of pieces like yesterday morning I would be getting a little concerned. There are a few dark edges on his fins but his fins have grey/black edging anyway, most look opaque so if there is a very small amount of rot, it should clear up on its own with the amount of water changes I am doing. But I will be keeping a eye on that.

I did give him some breakfast, 3 soaked NLS pellets, if he was bloated I wouldn't feed, but I don't want him getting weak so my gut tells me to feed sparingly so I am.

Anyway that's all for now and it's time for the second water change.
 

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Discussion Starter #56
I was thinking you really may want to put a floating cave in there. I have both the diy mesh caves, as well as well as the innards of a curler (weird huh?) in mine. The curler is just one of those plastic curlers with the stiff fuzzy stuff on the outside, with the fuzzy stuff ripped off and just the plastic bones left. It makes a perfect little floating cave for my fish that is a bad swimmer to rest in near the top. As you add water, he's going to need something near the top to rest on. :)

(I saw Lir sleeping in his and it reminded me that would be perfect for your guy)
I don't think we get them over here, I have never seen any for sale, but that would be great, although I am not sure how he would cope with the raised water level needed for it to float. I have no idea what a curler is?
 

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Discussion Starter #58
I think they mean a hair curling roller. The big plastic things you put in your hair for a perm XD
Correct me if I'm wrong!
Thanks for that, yes that makes sense, we have loads of hair care shops, that sell pretty much everything hair, so something I can look into getting for him.
 

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Discussion Starter #59
Hi guys, ok so he has been in the epsoms (1 tea spoon per gallon as recommended) for around 7 hrs, he seems to be gasping a bit now, so am getting a bit concerned, anyone else who as treated with epsoms can you advise if this is normal for their breathing to be harder during this treatment, I am currently thinking of taking the treatment out at the moment.
 

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Discussion Starter #60
It may have been me just getting a bit panicky, I have checked on him again and he was gasping a little then when up took air, but I think he did come back down a bit gentler. So maybe things are shifting. After I covered the tank over a bit, and now just checked he is resting back on the thermometer and his breathings seems fine now. So maybe just a false alarm. I will offer some Daphnia later tonight, if he takes it I will know all is well, if not I will start taking the epsoms out slowly.
 
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