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Discussion Starter #1
Hey everyone, I'm back to this forum after a years long hiatus and glad to be back! I have been keeping bettas on and off pretty much this whole time and I now have 7 years of fishkeeping under my belt.

That being said, just when I think I have it all figured out, I tend to second guess my decisions and do more research, and standards seem to change a lot every few years (at least among some communities)

This has all brought me back here, to a community I can trust with some seasoned veterans as well as new enthusiasts that can give me some sound advice and honest opinions...

ANYWAY....(sorry for the long winded intro) I have had a betta for 8 months now. I bought her as a fry from Petco (one of those "baby" bettas) and she has grown into a gorgeous girl. She was supposed to be a boy, but I'm glad she turned out to be female as I have never had a female betta and I love her playful personality! Anyway, I have had her in a 2.5 gallon tank the whole time I have had her. And he has grown a lot and seems to still have a decent amount of room as far as I can tell...but I thought it would be interesting to upgrade her to a 5 gallon and try keeping a single male guppy in the 2.5, since I had done research and asked experts and they said guppies don't need to be kept in groups.....

Well....when I walked into Petco to buy the guppy...I saw the most beautiful half moon king betta I have ever seen, and couldn't leave the store without him...so I bought him instead. And he got the 5 gallon and there in the 2.5 gallon my female betta remains.

Did I do the wrong thing? I feel bad not having upgrading her. Will the king be okay in the 5 and her in the 2.5? Would it have been a better decision to switch her to the 5 and add the guppy to the 2.5, and not get the king? I am super stressing that I am mistreating my bettas...

In case anyone was wondering...they are the sole livestock in their tanks and both tanks are cycled. I ran two sponge filters in the girl's tank before setting up the five, then transfered one of them to the 5 when adding the king.

Any thoughts? Thanks guys...
 

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You are the only one who can tell if the decision you made was right or wrong. I know the king you just got thanks you. The 2.5 is fine for your female, and the 5.5 is fine for the king.
Keep an eye on the water parameters by testing daily and doing the 25% water changes each week. I have never liked or trusted a sponge filter (but that is just me).
The key to their happiness is clean clear water. A 78 degree tank, with good filtration, and plants to rest in,and overhead cover to keep them stress free. OH yeah and a lot of love.

By the way Welcome back.
 

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I have a 2.5 and I still feel that I would never go any less, but my boy also seems just fine with that size. I think the challenge with small tanks is really keeping up on water changes and maintenance as with such a small amount of water, mistakes are easier to make and things can go wrong a lot faster. That's why I would generally recommend someone opt for at least a 5 gallon per betta, but if you're experienced enough, you can make a 2.5 gallon work fine.

I think bigger is always better for a betta (provided you have enough cover for them to feel safe) but I think you're decision was just fine! :)
 

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Welcome back! :cheers:

A 2.5 is fine for a "normal" size of Betta...male or female.

However, you might want to watch the King and decide if a five is enough as I am sure he is not yet fully grown. I used to think a five or 5.5 was fine for a larger Betta but then I started keeping them. IME, those on the smaller size did well enough. But some got too large (more than 2.0" or 2.5" body length) for *me* to feel comfortable with them in a 5.5. Those were sent to my eight or a 20 long divided x2 or x3.

I guess what I'm saying is be prepared to get another "normal" size if you need to up your King to a 10. :-D

BTW, I agree about females. I love female Betta when they are kept singly. They are more interactive and truly do have lots of personality...IMO, more than the males. They are certainly underappreciated.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thank you for the kind welcome back and your thoughts, everyone! Glad to know that I am doing right by my betta buddies.

RussellTheShihTzu, yes! If that king grows much more, I think he would looked cramped in that tank. He has a little room to grow, IMO, but not much. What did you mean by get another "normal". Do you mean buy another betta!? Don't tempt me! 😉

You said that the really large kings get up to 2.5" body length? Why do so many betta profiles say that that is their normal adult size? I feel like average body size for a normal betta (either gender) is 1.5" from what I have seen.

Also what exactly is a king betta? Are they just bred for size like, say, a great Dane? Or is there some hybridization between species going on? I have noticed that the shape of my King's mouth looks a bit different from the normies....

And could anyone with any guppy experience tell me if the single male gup would have done well in the 2.5 gallon? There is so much mixed info out there about guppies.

And lastly, I can't help but share some pictures of my betta fish....there is the female when I first got her, herself more recently, and the king
 

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Yes a single male guppy will do fine in a 2.5.

It's funny because of your post, Today I set up a new 5.5 in anticipation of a Very beautiful Blue mustard gas baby coming in the next couple of months. (Ma if your reading this That tank is set up and cycling Tell those little munchkins to grow quickly. LOL) However I needed a fish to really control my cycle, so I bought a lyretail Male guppy to put in. I planted the tank and placed a piece of Driftwood in for decor.
 

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Good to know Old Dog 59. Maybe someday I will keep a little male gup in the 2.5....maybe if I have to move the king to a 10. Betta will always be my first love as far as fish go, and their personalities are unbeatable for their small size, but I have been noticing more and more how cute (and tiny) guppies are. Kinda like betta but smaller and (no offence) dumber. I do already jave a male guppy, but he is in my 29 gallon community.

Are you going to try to keep the gup with the new betta? Or move him?
 

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Once I get my new boy Gilford the Guppy is going into a 10 gallon I already cycled. He will probably get some more company, knowing me I won't hesitate to doing a small community tank with the 10 gallon.
 

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Thank you for the kind welcome back and your thoughts, everyone! Glad to know that I am doing right by my betta buddies.

RussellTheShihTzu, yes! If that king grows much more, I think he would looked cramped in that tank. He has a little room to grow, IMO, but not much. What did you mean by get another "normal". Do you mean buy another betta!? Don't tempt me! 😉

You said that the really large kings get up to 2.5" body length? Why do so many betta profiles say that that is their normal adult size? I feel like average body size for a normal betta (either gender) is 1.5" from what I have seen.

Also what exactly is a king betta? Are they just bred for size like, say, a great Dane? Or is there some hybridization between species going on? I have noticed that the shape of my King's mouth looks a bit different from the normies....

And could anyone with any guppy experience tell me if the single male gup would have done well in the 2.5 gallon? There is so much mixed info out there about guppies.

And lastly, I can't help but share some pictures of my betta fish....there is the female when I first got her, herself more recently, and the king
I call regular-sized Betta a "normal." My understanding is they are under 2" body-only; Kings are 2"-3"; Giants 3"+. Some believe Kings are really half-Giants. I am one of them. I buy from someone who calls his larger Betta "Giant Geno" because one cannot predict their size as they are not "pure" Giant (i.e., no "normals" in pedigree). I have bought some that reached Giant size but most are around 2.75" to 3". Size depends so much on early rearing/feeding practices. @indjo breeds Giants so he can answer with much more authority than I.

If the 2.5 has a longer footprint a male Fancy Guppy should do okay. But they are such active fish I'm not sure I'd feel comfortable with one in a 2.5. It is more the footprint length that is important with fish than gallons. I wish the standard for describing proper tanks per species were defined by footprint instead of gallons. There are Dwarf Panda Guppies that would do better in a 2.5's footprint. I have a source if you are ever interested in a trio.

And, yep, I meant if your King gets too big for a five you will need to do *something* with the extra tank. ;-)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thank you for the kind welcome back and your thoughts, everyone! Glad to know that I am doing right by my betta buddies.

RussellTheShihTzu, yes! If that king grows much more, I think he would looked cramped in that tank. He has a little room to grow, IMO, but not much. What did you mean by get another "normal". Do you mean buy another betta!? Don't tempt me! 😉

You said that the really large kings get up to 2.5" body length? Why do so many betta profiles say that that is their normal adult size? I feel like average body size for a normal betta (either gender) is 1.5" from what I have seen.

Also what exactly is a king betta? Are they just bred for size like, say, a great Dane? Or is there some hybridization between species going on? I have noticed that the shape of my King's mouth looks a bit different from the normies....

And could anyone with any guppy experience tell me if the single male gup would have done well in the 2.5 gallon? There is so much mixed info out there about guppies.

And lastly, I can't help but share some pictures of my betta fish....there is the female when I first got her, herself more recently, and the king
I call regular-sized Betta a "normal." My understanding is they are under 2" body-only; Kings are 2"-3"; Giants 3"+. Some believe Kings are really half-Giants. I am one of them. I buy from someone who calls his larger Betta "Giant Geno" because one cannot predict their size as they are not "pure" Giant (i.e., no "normals" in pedigree). I have bought some that reached Giant size but most are around 2.75" to 3". Size depends so much on early rearing/feeding practices. @indjo breeds Giants so he can answer with much more authority than I.

If the 2.5 has a longer footprint a male Fancy Guppy should do okay. But they are such active fish I'm not sure I'd feel comfortable with one in a 2.5. It is more the footprint length that is important with fish than gallons. I wish the standard for describing proper tanks per species were defined by footprint instead of gallons. There are Dwarf Panda Guppies that would do better in a 2.5's footprint. I have a source if you are ever interested in a trio.

And, yep, I meant if your King gets too big for a five you will need to do *something* with the extra tank. <img style="max-width:100%;" src="http://www.bettafish.com/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" />
Thank you for all the info about kings and giants! If a normal betta is 2" or less, that puts them at about the same size as a guppy, correct? And yes, guppies are very fast and active. I just imagined my female betta as active as a guppy and I wouldn't feel okay with her in the 2.5 if she was...She does wiggle around from time to time, but nothing like a guppy...

I was talking about a standard rectangular aquarium, which puts it at .5 sq ft of floor space.

Do guppies do better in groups anyway? I asked the employee at my lfs, and he does know what he's talking about, and he said they don't care if other guppies are around because they just swim around mindlessly, looking for food. While this may be true, I can't help but feel like maybe they are a little more comfortable with at least a couple more of their kind. However, I cannot speak from experience.... I have one male alone in my community tank and he kinds follows my other fish around every now and then, but who knows if he's just looking for food. And he is a little skittish....but idk if that's just how they are. He is very physically healthy and his tail has grown bigger since I got him.
 

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Thank you for all the info about kings and giants! If a normal betta is 2" or less, that puts them at about the same size as a guppy, correct? And yes, guppies are very fast and active. I just imagined my female betta as active as a guppy and I wouldn't feel okay with her in the 2.5 if she was...She does wiggle around from time to time, but nothing like a guppy...

I was talking about a standard rectangular aquarium, which puts it at .5 sq ft of floor space.

Do guppies do better in groups anyway? I asked the employee at my lfs, and he does know what he's talking about, and he said they don't care if other guppies are around because they just swim around mindlessly, looking for food. While this may be true, I can't help but feel like maybe they are a little more comfortable with at least a couple more of their kind. However, I cannot speak from experience.... I have one male alone in my community tank and he kinds follows my other fish around every now and then, but who knows if he's just looking for food. And he is a little skittish....but idk if that's just how they are. He is very physically healthy and his tail has grown bigger since I got him.
Guppies are shoaling fish and, as such, should not be kept alone. Guppies were my first fish and while I now only keep Dwarf Panda Guppies, I can tell you they do best with others of their kind. They might do okay alone but if you have ever watched a proper number of 6+ (even all males) you will see their shoaling behavior...it is quite a colorful sight!

If they were the only fish the 2.5 (mine is 12" x 6" x 8" high) I would see how three Fancy Guppies do. You can always add them to the community tank if you are uncomfortable. Another option for the 2.5 would be either shrimp or a couple of Dario Dario. But with the Dario you would have to commit to feeding live or frozen food as they do not eat flakes or pellets.
 

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Guppies are shoaling fish and, as such, should not be kept alone. Guppies were my first fish and while I now only keep Dwarf Panda Guppies, I can tell you they do best with others of their kind. They might do okay alone but if you have ever watched a proper number of 6+ (even all males) you will see their shoaling behavior...it is quite a colorful sight!

If they were the only fish the 2.5 (mine is 12" x 6" x 8" high) I would see how three Fancy Guppies do. You can always add them to the community tank if you are uncomfortable. Another option for the 2.5 would be either shrimp or a couple of Dario Dario. But with the Dario you would have to commit to feeding live or frozen food as they do not eat flakes or pellets.
Thank you, thank you, thank you! That answers my burning question! I was going to ads bristlenose pleco to my 29 with my angel and guppy and leave it at that, but maybe I will add some more guppies as well, especially if it will make the single one do better. Would that be heavily stocked? Also I'm really sorry this is shifting away from betta tank talk.
 

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You can shift your own thread wherever you want it to go. ;-)

I would go to aquadvisor.com and plug in the relevant information. They tend to be a little conservative. Size-wise I think you should be fine; would depend on having enough filtration.

I believe I had Guppies, Neons, a Pleco, Honey Gourami and some Rams along with a shoal of Cory. At one point some baby Angels and baby Clown Loaches which eventually went to the 100-gallon.
 

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We (hobbyists in my area) don't recognize kings or half giants. Anything that reaches 5.5 cm BO is considered a giant (original size when first developed/created).

Both genetics and rearing plays a big role in their growth. Lets say an individual carries all the needed genes to be giant. But wasn't fed enough and or kept in small tanks. He will grow, but not to the maximum length (true giants can reach 4"BO). . . . On the other hand, lets say an individual doesn't carry the full set of genetic coding. Though it was kept in big tanks and fed 6 times daily all it would eat, it won't exceed the size limited by its genes.
**** Giant x giant often only produces a maximum of 30% giants. The rest will be half giants, big bettas, and regular size. Except for the half giants, these smaller bettas are not giant carriers and will not produce giants.
. . . . . .

I stayed away from this thread because I keep my bettas differently. I am used to keeping mine in smaller containers, especially my breeders (don't want females to outgrow my males). So a 5g is, to me, a good size for kings/giants. It allows growth, and sufficient space. Yes, you may need to do more maintenance because consequently more feeding causes more waste release.

Due to their appetite and fast growth, giants have weaker immune systems. This is more apparent as they get older, move less. Keeping water clean is a must. A good cycled tank should be best for them. Other than that, they have similar needs to regular sized bettas.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
We (hobbyists in my area) don't recognize kings or half giants. Anything that reaches 5.5 cm BO is considered a giant (original size when first developed/created).

Both genetics and rearing plays a big role in their growth. Lets say an individual carries all the needed genes to be giant. But wasn't fed enough and or kept in small tanks. He will grow, but not to the maximum length (true giants can reach 4"BO). . . . On the other hand, lets say an individual doesn't carry the full set of genetic coding. Though it was kept in big tanks and fed 6 times daily all it would eat, it won't exceed the size limited by its genes.
**** Giant x giant often only produces a maximum of 30% giants. The rest will be half giants, big bettas, and regular size. Except for the half giants, these smaller bettas are not giant carriers and will not produce giants.
. . . . . .

I stayed away from this thread because I keep my bettas differently. I am used to keeping mine in smaller containers, especially my breeders (don't want females to outgrow my males). So a 5g is, to me, a good size for kings/giants. It allows growth, and sufficient space. Yes, you may need to do more maintenance because consequently more feeding causes more waste release.

Due to their appetite and fast growth, giants have weaker immune systems. This is more apparent as they get older, move less. Keeping water clean is a must. A good cycled tank should be best for them. Other than that, they have similar needs to regular sized bettas.
Thank you for the information, Indjo! I agree that my betta seems to have enough room at the size he is now. He has been in the tank for a week now and seems to be doing great!

I will keep in mind his weakened immune system and be very careful with his water quality.
 
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