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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone!

Well days ago I got a really nice even finned HMPK super red pair from a really great person on AB. I released them to each other and today is the second day of them being together.

The male and female (when FIRST released) went head on flaring at each other then doing the "Betta Dance" (a snake like pattern of movement shared between either one or both the male and female bettas while in the process of courtship) in other words, they were wiggling back and forth. Now the female was nipped a few times (not severely) and she isn't Petrified of the male, but she is doing the natural swim away that they would usually do. She can hid under the heater for hours until the male chases her and tries to lure her.

The male has been trying to lure her to the nest since they were released so he is definitely ready. Now on the other hand the female is not convinced that he will be "Gentle." He gets frustrated because she turns her caudal to him and he chases her. This is normal behavior and yes I know they usually spawn in the matter of 3-4 days averagely, but I was wondering,

Long story short...IS there a way to encourage the female to spawn with the male?

I had somewhat the same problem with Korra and Draco. Korra was ready, but Draco was not trying to spawn. Now it is the usual other way around.

Has anyone had any experience with actually encouraging the female to spawn with the male? I have heard of using live foods, but all I have is BBS eggs and very few milimeters in a vial until I can find a way to get more.

P.S.
Sorry for writing a whole story!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
@indo: Thank you. She was aggressive. She still is healthy. What is currently going on is that she would sit under the heater and he has been trying to lure her for three days now since the first day of introduction. She doesn't just swim off panting or anything, but she will wait until he is pretty close to turn her head and face her caudal at him. Then he gets frustrated and nudges her with his mouth open on her odd, but doesn't nip her body. Her fins aren't bad either so I would say that she is "stubborn" and he is one of the most "gentle" males I have had that were HMPK.

In this predicament, what would you do?

@Edifiler: I already have IAL in the tank with the IAL extract making the tank a nice amber color.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I am currently having this problem as well. The female is healthy and he has been very gentle with her. The water is tanned and she'll go check out the nest, but turns back part way and then he chases her. They've been together for two days I think. She has one little nip in her fin anal fin and that's all so I'm leaving them together. He is continually adding to the nest and chasing her, so that seems like a good sign. She was VERY flirty when in her chimney, so I thought they'd be quick. If they don't spawn in the next 4 days I'll re-condition and try again.
I have the exact same set up. I think yours will spawn soon since its only been two days. Also at least your female is actually going to the bubble nest. Mine isn't.

Though my male made a very big nest and I don't want to take him out. If I have to I will. He is always adding new bubbles to his nest though.

Would I be able to just take the female out to recondition or would I have to take both of them out separate from eye view?
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Even though this is very normal and patientsis key, I must admit it is just a bit annoying and frustrating when you think they are going to embrace and he just runs her off.

I think I am going.to have to recondition them if they don't spawn by tomorrow night because it'll be the 4th day.

I wish my female would go head down, its the female that is really being the difficult one. Though who can blame her she is getting nipped and chased LOL.

@GT: I have the same thing happen but she isn't at the nest. His nest is pretty big considering my other males nests.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Okay. So I guess I will wait until Thursday to take her out if she doesn't spawn by then.

I also would be getting my other fish by round that time considering they will be sent out by Monday or tuesday along with another salamander pair I'm really looking forward to by wednesday.

I really want to have some nice super reds though as well.

I also would really like to sell my 3 males that I bought, but don't know how to ship. I have never done it before and I think I would have to ask my local post office about their policy and other little questions about prices of shipping.
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
I'm not sure because it's undesired in my country so people avoid/cull them. I've never heard stories either. But most breeders hear say that what ever line should be achieved in 3-4 generations at most.

Good luck to all of you. Hope everything works out as planned.
What if there was a geno trait that you wanted to include in the fish? Have you ever tried this?
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
Well when I said geno trait, I mean like a gene that would always be present in your own line. Like for example, my friend used to breed platties or mollies and she eventually added a red male or female to get a red spot on the caudal, all of her fish had this red spot on the caudal and she could tell it was from her stock whenever they were mixed with some pet store males or females.

I hope you know what I mean.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Well my pair started embracing, the female released her first few eggs and ate them, dad didn't even look for them, still working on his epic nest -_- Hopefully they will figure it out better later.
Which pair is this? I remember you saying that your one marble HMPK pair are actually very fast spawners and she bars up every time she sees the male.
 

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Discussion Starter · #45 ·
MY SUPER RED PAIR HAVE EMBRACED!!!! It was around 7:50pm or 8pm that they started. Still going at it as I type.

I guess it was just a matter of time and patience. I usually have a lot of both, but I guess for my first spawn of getting back into the breeding has really changed after a month or so of not breeding. But what I'm most amazed at is that the female is actually helping the male this time. I usually have the female eating the eggs, but she is stuffing them in the bubble nest right along with the male. So far there are....well...a lot of eggs....let's just keep it at that for now.

The males seems to be "forcing" the female to embrace. He will go up to her and most of the time she is willing, but he just wraps himself on her and then the "click" goes. He has caught himself stuck quite a few times which is pretty funny to watch.

@Amphibianite: I'm so happy to hear that your pair worked out finally. Well your pair was faster than mine. Today is the 5th day and I was actually thinking about taking her out and reconditioning them. I'm so glad I didn't. Well my pair spawned today and are STILL spawning now at 8:55pm eastern time. I think we may experience some fast results depending on the temperature of the water. I would be interested to compare results with you when you are able to tell gender and size, ect...they are now finished at 9:32pm sice the female retreat and was run off for a bit of time. She also stayed at the bottom

Lastly, does anyone know how to upload pictures from an iPad to photobucket maybe? If not I will directly upload them t the desktop.
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·
Well I was wrong about him being so gentle over night. Her anal fin is in shreds and the one side I can see at this point has a few scales missing.
I am trying a technique suggested, and am floating a second male in a cup in the tank. Seeing if he will make the main main get territorial and blow a nest. I will be removing the 2nd male in a few minutes. If this fails, and I do not see signs of any change in the breeding I will try another technique of placing a second female in the tank (in a cup) to make the first female "Jealous" see what happens.
If these fail I may consider removing them to recondition, and move on to my second prepared pair.

Now here is a question that I can't remember the answer to. Is there such a thing as the female being too small? I have two small females that are still fairly young say 4-5 months, they have had breeding bars since being next to any male, and are in fact eggy. Could a male say half again or so their size embrace them?

Well to answer your question anyway, yes there is such thing as too small. You would wait until they are at least very close to an inch or a bit more in length. It is important that she can fit the male's size just a little so he won't get too frustrated and potentially kill her.
 

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Discussion Starter · #48 ·
Hurray grats on your spawn BL2033. I will happily so a comparison with you. I have my heater set for 82 degrees, but it is very cold outside the house. Snow on the ground. My room sits at approx 74 do to space heater used to heat most my tanks (works wonderfully actually)
I have mine set at 82-84* depending on how cold it is in the house. We have had a really good winter this year here in NY. No snow and when there is, very thin and melts fast.

And your pair are HMPKs right?
 

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Discussion Starter · #51 ·
Yay for all of us having success.

BL2033 - thats what I thought. I was looking at my MG CT girl and realized she is still quite small. When I bought her she was less than an inch and mislabled at a veil. Petco loves to mislabel and get tiny girls in.

Yep my pair are both HMPK and I think both are dragon too.

Grats GT on spawn btw
I noticed that with ct females, they tend to be small in size and have larger stomachs than the average bettas. Also i would say to feed her a bit more than usual and then transfer her to a bigger tank. She sounds like a fry if I'm not mistaken.

Also GT congrats. Did they spawn today as well?
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
BL yeah I placed her about 3 months max, she was tiny, so is the other CT girl I got same day. So I do feed them both well, and both are in nice tanks. I will be feeding her more now.
All I would advise is to feed well and a bigger tank environment which you said you are providing.
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Discussion Starter · #56 ·
I also have this happening as well.i have a gift card so I am trying to get some nice tanks for them mostly dividers since I have plenty bettas and some betta containers that you stick in the tank with little dividers that come with it. They work really good!
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