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Discussion Starter · #101 ·
Whatever you do, do not keep your Betta in one tablespoon per gallon of Aquarium Salt. This amount should be used of no more than 8-10 minutes' duration. It can also be lethal for a very weak fish. Sourced from too many to count but here's just one:

"Aquarium salt dip requires 1 table spoon per gallon of water. The time duration varies from 5 to 8 minutes depending on the severity. If the disease is related to fin rot or fungal infections, limit it to 5 minutes and for anything severe extend to 8 minutes.
"Important note: Never exceed the time duration over 8 minutes as it will decay your fish skin instead and burn its skin." (Emphasis mine)

Researching amounts to use for Bubbles' issues the recommended dose in not one teaspoon per gallon. It is one tablespoon per five gallons. That is around a half-teaspoon per gallon. Do a 50% water change after four days. As BettaLoverSara noted, replace only the amount you remove; IOW, remove a gallon and replace with one gallon with .5 teaspoons of salt.

Salt is also not a "cure." It is an aid in fighting diseases.
Thank you so much for your reply. Now I’m so worried that I may have made things worse for him. Since I already dosed with 1tsp per gallon, should I do a water change today and not replace any salt? That way I’d be removing the excess or should I still wait another three days to change it and still replace some..? Do I then keep water changes every four days or daily? Not sure if the four days is only initially or regularly. Sorry for all the questions. It’s just confusing with so many different opinions. I want to make sure I do what’s best for him or at least what may give him a good chance. That being said, what is your take on my current course of action — if salt is just an aid, is there anything else I should be doing instead or in addition to?
 

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I think you should do a 30-50% water change and not add salt. Then it will dilute it a bit, and make it safer.
 

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Discussion Starter · #104 ·
Perfect! I will do a partial water change today and not replace any salt. I'm in the process of making IAL tea, so I will wait to do the water change when it's ready so I can add some tea in the process. Thank you both so much!
 

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I know I said I was going to leave advice giving to Dani to everyone else, however I feel not giving any salt at all would be detrimental for this fish so I am glad you are not going that route...
He is in no state to wait around .

I think 0.5 Tsp would be better vs no salt at all to be honest. Do not dilute the salt too much.

I still believe he can do better with this. I am unsure if he has other things going on but we will see!

The last thing I would do at this point is have no salt at all or lower it to the point it is less than 0.5 . The heat is making the infection thrive and you need something that it will not do well in.

Yes I was a beginner when I learned about the salt, but thinking about it yesterday and considering this, I do not regret my Ich treatment with salt or treating my other betta with fin rot with salt.

They lived for many years after treatment and if I had used something else they may not of. Like one fish I had with ich and the other with fin rot who sadly did not make it because I was scared away from treatments that might work at the time.
So yes I might have lowered the dosage if I got to do things differently, but I absolutely would use salt again. They survived and and were back to their old selves which is a better outcome than many bettas I have seen.


I hope Dani, that your beautiful boy will recover! :)
 

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I do not give advice based on what I find on another forum or YouTube. Too many base their advice on what they think instead of what they know. Instead, I search out long-time keepers of fish and then find studies or more long-time fish keepers to back up any advice.
I see what you are saying and it does make sense, although there have been times where I was glad I went a little off path when treating my fish.

I still feel like a low dose would help Dani's betta. A little higher of a dose even more so, but he is not my fish so I can not make such a decision.

I truly hope he recovers at 0.5 tsp per gallon.

If we look at it this way, if we do nothing for him he will not recover, because he has an infection that is spreading.

Maybe such high doses as I used on my other fish (this was around 6 years ago) were too much, but at this point thinking about it , I do not regret the treatment I used at the time.

They did recover and lived many years later.

I would have lowered the dose if I could do it again and look into other natural treatments to put in their food as well, however I would much rather see the fish survive vs pass away because the treatment was not strong enough.

It may seem like I advocate strong treatments and this is not the case at all! Far from it actually. I always prefer doing the most gentle thing possible when possible. For your average case of fin rot that has not progressed , simply doing garlic in their food, IAL, and clean warm water would absolutely be my first choice and what I would do for my own fish.

I truly believe that salt treatment is crucial at this point though, as without a doubt I think the infection is spreading and fast.

The heat is making the bacteria thrive and I am personally glad she added that salt now even at a low dose it may be helpful hopefully!
 

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this fish is not going to be harmed by too little salt. He’s had multiple treatments thrown at him, if his natural immune system can’t take over and fight whatever he is going through at this point than salt is not really going to do much. Too much salt can kill him and he won’t have the chance.
 

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this fish is not going to be harmed by too little salt. He’s had multiple treatments thrown at him, if his natural immune system can’t take over and fight whatever he is going through at this point than salt is not really going to do much. Too much salt can kill him and he won’t have the chance.

Hi Sara, I agree with you.

I would never repeat the doses I used on my fish a long time ago knowing what I do now. All I am saying is I am not against using salt as a treatment and still consider it beneficial at a low dose.
I was not talking about increasing his dose drastically and I think Dani is doing good at the 0.5 dose.
All I was saying when I said "if he were mine I would increase the dose slightly" was maybe 1 extra 0.5 tsp in the entire tank. Not per gallon and really not enough to harm him further. He is not my fish so we really do not have to worry about that anyway!

We all want this fish to get better. Do I regret recommending the large amounts of salt? Yes of course! I will not recommend that much salt again, nor will I ever use it.

I truly hope he gets better!
 

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Doing something unconventional with our own fish it is one thing. Suggesting the same with someone else's fish and possibly causing it harm or death is another: We know we're taking a risk; members do not.

In the last six weeks, Bubbles has had everything thrown at him except the kitchen sink and advice to throw yet more. At some point enough is enough. He is already severely compromised and well-meaning members will compromise him even more. And his poor owner. :( So much conflicting information and misdiagnoses.

If he is going to survive Bubbles' body needs rest and nutritious food. He is getting the latter as frozen is perfect for healing fish. Now he needs the former. The IAL or Rooibos will help calm him and help prevent fungal or bacterial infections.

It is a divided argument whether Ammonia is more dense at the bottom. If there's the slightest possibility it's true, I would do as previously suggested and get him off the bottom. If a breeder box like Animal15 suggested won't fit use a large net with something in the bottom to keep it open. Most pet stores will give you a Betta cup if you don't already have one.

You doing you're best but keep in mind there are some bacteria that are med-resistant. As long as Bubbles is willing to eat I would keep him going. But if he stops eating you will have a difficult decision to make.
 

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Doing something unconventional with our own fish it is one thing. Suggesting the same with someone else's fish and possibly causing it harm or death is another: We know we're taking a risk; members do not.

In the last six weeks, Bubbles has had everything thrown at him except the kitchen sink and advice to throw yet more. At some point enough is enough. He is already severely compromised and well-meaning members will compromise him even more. And his poor owner. :( So much conflicting information and misdiagnoses.

If he is going to survive Bubbles' body needs rest and nutritious food. He is getting the latter as frozen is perfect for healing fish. Now he needs the former. The IAL or Rooibos will help calm him and help prevent fungal or bacterial infections.

It is a divided argument whether Ammonia is more dense at the bottom. If there's the slightest possibility it's true, I would do as previously suggested and get him off the bottom. If a breeder box like Animal15 suggested won't fit use a large net with something in the bottom to keep it open. Most pet stores will give you a Betta cup if you don't already have one.

You doing you're best but keep in mind there are some bacteria that are med-resistant. As long as Bubbles is willing to eat I would keep him going. But if he stops eating you will have a difficult decision to make.

I would never try anything that could cause death to my own fish or Bubbles knowingly.

As stated before I was a beginner 6 years ago I used the dose I did.
The bettas I recently had did not get sick often and passed away from old age.

I honestly did not know 1 tsp per gallon could kill a betta and only mentioned it because it was what I had learned years ago and it saved countless of my bettas in the past.

Knowing what I do now I would not use this dose again.

I hope you all understand my intentions were good.

I want Bubbles to be cured like everyone else but medications can kill a fish also, even at proper dosages sometimes so they are not gentle treatments.

In that respect 0.5 tsp per gallon would not be more harsh on him, but Dani has done the best she can I know. it is stressful having fish you do not know how to make better so I feel for her.

I apologize for giving any advice at all.
 

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I would never try anything that could cause death to my own fish or Bubbles knowingly.

As stated before I was a beginner 6 years ago I used the dose I did.
The bettas I recently had did not get sick often and passed away from old age.

I honestly did not know 1 tsp per gallon could kill a betta and only mentioned it because it was what I had learned years ago and it saved countless of my bettas in the past.

Knowing what I do now I would not use this dose again.

I hope you all understand my intentions were good.

I want Bubbles to be cured like everyone else but medications can kill a fish also, even at proper dosages sometimes so they are not gentle treatments.

In that respect 0.5 tsp per gallon would not be more harsh on him, but Dani has done the best she can I know. it is stressful having fish you do not know how to make better so I feel for her.

I apologize for giving any advice at all.
Nobody thinks you have ill intentions. I too have treated fin rot with salt so I understand your position.

I think the part that is being missed is that the treatment is no longer about the fin rot itself. The previous treatments should have stopped it. It is now about his ability to recover. The salt in my opinion will make that recovery harder not easier.

The debate over salt vs no salt should end here. The owner has enough information to make an educated decision and anything more is just for arguments sake.

All advice with good intentions is welcome but that does not mean it will come without counter opinion. That is the purpose of a forum.
 

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Discussion Starter · #112 ·
I'm very sad to report that Bubbles died a few minutes ago.

I did an almost 50% water change yesterday and only added some IAL tea. Last night it felt like he started giving up the fight -- he did not eat as usual, he was not very interested in his food. This morning the water looked cloudy, not the brownish color I was hoping for, it looked almost dense if that makes sense. Part of me wanted to add the filter back on yesterday, but ultimately continued to go without it. Anyway, I tried to feed him but this time he did not eat anything at all. He made a few trips to the top but did not seem to be gasping for air, his breathing looked normal. I started prepping things to do a water change and that's when I noticed that something was off, he looked stiff. I was with him when it happened, not sure if that is a good thing to experience, but needless to say I'm pretty emotional about the whole thing. I'd like to think that he passed peacefully and hopefully did not experience much pain or discomfort. Even knowing that I did the best I could, I can't help feeling guilty and second guessing every little thing I did or did not do. I guess that's inevitable, we tend to do that to ourselves.

I want to thank all of you again for taking the time to offer your advice and support, I could not have done this without your guidance. And I know you all shared your thoughts and suggestions with the best intentions, we all wanted Bubbles to get better, I have not doubt in my mind :) .. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.

I'm not sure if I'll get into fish ownership again, but I will be keeping this wonderful community handy in case I need to reach out again. Take care.
 

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I’m so sorry to hear that. You truly did everything you could.
I hope that you do not give up on fish keeping. I have had a number of situations over the years that have made me want to quit but the little creatures bring so much joy that I always come back.
 

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You made a heroic effort. I hope you take comfort in that.
 
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