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Thank you for checking in. Things had been going well, trending in the right direction but over the past couple of weeks have taken a turn for the worse. See photos. The rear fin is curled and the main one underneath is torn. We dont know what happened. He barely can swim but is still eating. We are going to do some frequent water changes ASAP. Hope we can save him. View attachment 1036462
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Hi Rob, I’m real sorry to hear this. I’m glad he was doing well for some time but I know how disappointing it is when things turn again. If you still have the Indian almond leaves, definitely use those. Float or tea. I know you already know all my typical advice so it’s all the same with increased wc, leaves or tea, maybe keep his tank light out or dimmed if you can. I see the Kordons bottle so that’s great you’re using it.

When you say he can barely swim, is he mainly hanging out at the surface or bottom of the tank. Have you noticed any he’s fighting to swim? Like with SBD?

Remind me, did you go through a round of Kanaplex or Furan2 with help from @Veloran?

Also, how is Curly’s attitude? Does he seem depressed? Is he responsive to you, or sort of hiding from you? How is his breathing? Does it seem labored? I know that was an issue before.

I’m hoping someone can offer some insight on this but I notice his eye looks cloudy… possibly. Did you notice this or is it just the pic quality? It might be due to age but I’m wondering if it could be an indication of another illness.

If you’d like to list your parameters, that would be great, too. Or any other details you think are important. Curly is a true fighter.
 

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Hi, do you have access to a hospital tank? Even a clean tupperware storage container would work.
If you want to try to hit this thing hard, get him into a hospital and start on the Kanaplex. We might be a little beyond the methylene blue at this point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #83 · (Edited)
Hi Rob, I’m real sorry to hear this. I’m glad he was doing well for some time but I know how disappointing it is when things turn again. If you still have the Indian almond leaves, definitely use those. Float or tea. I know you already know all my typical advice so it’s all the same with increased wc, leaves or tea, maybe keep his tank light out or dimmed if you can. I see the Kordons bottle so that’s great you’re using it.

When you say he can barely swim, is he mainly hanging out at the surface or bottom of the tank. Have you noticed any he’s fighting to swim? Like with SBD?

Remind me, did you go through a round of Kanaplex or Furan2 with help from @Veloran?

Also, how is Curly’s attitude? Does he seem depressed? Is he responsive to you, or sort of hiding from you? How is his breathing? Does it seem labored? I know that was an issue before.

I’m hoping someone can offer some insight on this but I notice his eye looks cloudy… possibly. Did you notice this or is it just the pic quality? It might be due to age but I’m wondering if it could be an indication of another illness.

If you’d like to list your parameters, that would be great, too. Or any other details you think are important. Curly is a true fighter.
Thanks again for getting back to me.

Here are some just taken photos and a short video: 8 new items by Robert Melstein

As you can see, the fins are not in good shape - concerned that once they get to his body, it's all over.

We have never medicated him - tried just focusing on water quality and food - but wonder if it's time to try. I have Kanaplex and API Fin Cure ready to go. If we didn't add a medicine, our plan was to do another 25-40% water change tomorrow (we did a 60-70% water change yesterday).

He is almost exclusively hanging out at the top of the tank. When we feed him, if the food pellets drop he tries to go after them by diving. He definitely looks like he's having trouble swimming. When we shut his light off, he does try to swim around a bit - this is usual behavior for him; maybe he sees his reflection better. The breathing doesn't seem too labored though.

His demeanor doesn't seem too bad, except he's just sitting at the top of the tank. When our son comes into the room, he does respond.

As for parameters, I checked everything yesterday. pH was about 7.6 but this is consistent, 0 nitrites, possibly slightly elevated nitrates but hard to tell, ammonia looked to be 0 to .25 ppm. Temperature is about 78-80.

One other variable: A few weeks back we started feeding him San Francisco Bay Brand Frozen Spirulina Brine Shrimp. He really likes it, but it's hard to manage in the tank - anything that he doesn't eat floats around and to the bottom and it's hard to remove. We're thinking this may be leading to a change in tank parameters and leading to the fin rot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #84 ·
Hi, do you have access to a hospital tank? Even a clean tupperware storage container would work.
If you want to try to hit this thing hard, get him into a hospital and start on the Kanaplex. We might be a little beyond the methylene blue at this point.
Can you clarify this for me? Do we take him out of his current tank, put him in a small tupperware-like container, and add the Kanaplex to this hospital "tank" - the amount of the dose whch would be based on the size of the tupperware?

Could trying to get him out of his tank cause a lot of stress - and make things worse? Or do you think we're beyond this point?
Pics and video of his current condition: 8 new items by Robert Melstein
 

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Can you clarify this for me? Do we take him out of his current tank, put him in a small tupperware-like container, and add the Kanaplex to this hospital "tank" - the amount of the dose whch would be based on the size of the tupperware?

Could trying to get him out of his tank cause a lot of stress - and make things worse? Or do you think we're beyond this point?
Pics and video of his current condition: 8 new items by Robert Melstein
Hi Rob,
Poor Curly. I would put him in about a 1-1.5 gallon Tupperware or fish bowl with a heater and bubbler and start medicating. Yes, you’re right about dosing. On the pkg for it it says to give with food but I just add it to the water. The times I’ve used it my fish were refusing food so it’s your choice since he’s eating.

I think at this point removing him won’t be stressful. I would use a cup to remove and move him instead of a net. You could scoop him out with it. If you want to net him though, no worries.

You’ll want to make sure the temp is the same as his current tank, the water is conditioned. I would add the Kordons because it’s made to allow medications to bind better as well as the other benefits. You could also put an IAL in for some cover. I don’t think a filter is necessary as long as there is a bubbler in there.

The frozen food shouldn’t cause a huge problem as long as wc are frequent (he’s in a 2.5G right?). I use tweezers to feed my bettas frozen food. It really helps. I make sure they get it all until next piece. With the daphnia I use a dropper. Anyway, I totally get it and that’s a great question too.

I think you’ll feel better when you have him settled in the hospital. Keep it dark and quiet and think all good thoughts. Kanaplex is strong but very effective too. There are always risks since they are such fragile little fish but it will tackle bacteria or fungal infections.

Good Luck! @Veloran may have better or different instructions and he’s the pro when it comes to meds for bettas so go with his advice if it’s different than mine.
 

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Hey Rob, I'm so sorry, I kept hitting refresh on the page daily and because it saw I was on the page it never notified me via icon of an update.
At this point, with what you mentioned about the brine shrimp possibly fouling his tank, I think it would be beneficial to remove him and put him in the hospital tank and dose him there while you do a deep clean on his home.
While it may be stressful for him, I think it would be less stressful than trying to clean his tank with him in it. It would also allow you to get a much deeper clean on his original tank.

Another option if you don't have an appropriate hospital tank would be to remove everything from his original tank (gravel and all) and dose his meds in there. Because his tank would be bare, you would want to cover it with a dark cloth to help him feel more secure. This of course would require removing (cupping) him once and then putting him back.
 

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Discussion Starter · #87 ·
We weren't able to get him a hospital tank, so we went with the three day course of Kanaplex in his current environment. The third dose was given yesterday (not via food, just dropping it into the tank). Main reason for this is that it seems the fish is having trouble eating. He wants to eat but sometimes is spitting out the pellets a couple of minutes after we give them. He's also having more trouble swimming and as you can see, the fin situation is getting worse.

Are we pretty much at the end here, sadly? Or, is there another treatment to try? If there is anything else to treat with, we can try something as the hospital tank.

New pictures here:
8 new items by Robert Melstein

Thank you all for your continued help.
 

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We weren't able to get him a hospital tank, so we went with the three day course of Kanaplex in his current environment. The third dose was given yesterday (not via food, just dropping it into the tank). Main reason for this is that it seems the fish is having trouble eating. He wants to eat but sometimes is spitting out the pellets a couple of minutes after we give them. He's also having more trouble swimming and as you can see, the fin situation is getting worse.

Are we pretty much at the end here, sadly? Or, is there another treatment to try? If there is anything else to treat with, we can try something as the hospital tank.

New pictures here:
8 new items by Robert Melstein

Thank you all for your continued help.
Hi Rob,
How is Curly? Did he respond to the treatment in any way? I’m sorry i am just seeing your latest post now. I don’t even know what to say. It just breaks my heart seeing him. I will be on the forum throughout the day/evening to see if you replied.

Lauren
 

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Discussion Starter · #89 ·
Hi Rob,
How is Curly? Did he respond to the treatment in any way? I’m sorry i am just seeing your latest post now. I don’t even know what to say. It just breaks my heart seeing him. I will be on the forum throughout the day/evening to see if you replied.

Lauren
Hi Lauren,
Not much improvement. On another board, someone said to do another course of the Kanaplex - finish the treatment - and then do another antibiotic (like Furan).

Here are some more photos: 6 new items by Robert Melstein

He seems to be having some trouble eating - he is spitting out a pellet or two after trying to chew them.

At this point, we will probably try the meds again. Thanks for checking in!

-Rob
 

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Hi Rob,
I’m so sorry. it makes me so sad.

His gills look swollen to me but he doesn’t appear to be breathing rapidly. I’m wondering if he has gill flukes. I’d have to do some research but you could always mention this on the other forum. It could also be a fungal infection.

I’m hoping @Veloran can advise further but I think another round of Kanaplex is aidea. Furan 2 is good too. You could do both at once from what I’m reading online. I can’t advise on how much to use but I know this combo of meds is ok.

I’m wondering if you should try a methalyne blue dip as well. Do you happen to have any? Has anyone on the other forum mentioned this. I don’t think it will hurt. It can be hard to find locally for me, but now I keep it on hand for these types of emergencies.

This is what it looks like but I’m sure there’s other brands.

I will keep Curly in my thoughts.
 

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Hey, this is a tough one, but I really do believe that he needs to get out of the environment.
Would it be possible to clear out his tank. Cup him, take everything out and put him in with just fresh water, his heater and his filter.
While the Kanaplex may help, if there's something in the water that's affecting him, he will just keep on regressing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #92 ·
Hey, this is a tough one, but I really do believe that he needs to get out of the environment.
Would it be possible to clear out his tank. Cup him, take everything out and put him in with just fresh water, his heater and his filter.
While the Kanaplex may help, if there's something in the water that's affecting him, he will just keep on regressing.
I am in the process of this right now. I got him into a 1/2 gallon holding tank, and am cleaning everything in hot water in his original tank. Will refill his original (2.5 gallon) tank with fresh water and maybe just his gravel, log, heater and aerator (no filter) so he has something familiar and then treat with Jungle Fungus Clear and Kanaplex. Let me know if anything doesn't sound right.
 

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Don't put the log, doesn't seem like he's using it anyway, I want to make sure it's not leeching.
Also, cover his tank with a dark towel as it will be pretty sparse in there, it will make him feel more secure.
 

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Discussion Starter · #94 · (Edited)
Don't put the log, doesn't seem like he's using it anyway, I want to make sure it's not leeching.
Also, cover his tank with a dark towel as it will be pretty sparse in there, it will make him feel more secure.
Hi again - I am looking for some advice based on the following update.
We treated Curly with Kanaplex and Jungle Fizz Fungus cure. We waited about 2 weeks and then a few days ago tried again with the Kanaplex blended into his food with Focus.

Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to have helped with the fin rot. Things don't look like they've gotten worse, but they don't seem to be turning the corner either.

He is still eating, but occasionally spits out a pellet here and there. In terms of behavior, he mostly spends his days at the top of the tank. When he sees me, he does become active but it's hard for him to swim and kind of just floats back up to the surface.

On another board I was advised to try Aqua Cipro - as maybe the previous meds did not work and this infection is just stubborn.

Nitrates and nitrites are 0, pH is 7.6 (this is how it's always been), ammonia looks to be 0.25 ppm - will do a 25% water change tomorrow.

Anyone have any further advice? Thank you!

Rob
 

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Hi Rob,

just read through everything to catch up. While I absolutely admire your dedication, at this point I would be considering euthanasia. It may not be the popular answer but you have tried countless things over the course of a few months. Bettas are sturdy little fish and he just has not improved as should be expected. He is extremely thin already and given that he refuses to eat, he just doesn’t have the physical strength/ability to recover.

Pet store bettas are notorious for being horribly inbred and sickly.

You have gone above and beyond for Curly but I think it might be time to let him rest❤
 

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Can you refresh me, is he in a hospital tank?
At this point he might need to be to eliminate a contaminant in the environment.

I'm not familiar with Aqua-Cipro , I'll need to look it up in detail but it looks to do the same job as Kanaplex. Kanaplex is usually the big on the block with the next step being a Kanaplex / Furan 2 combo. It's rough on the fish but knocks out most everything that is infectious.
 

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Discussion Starter · #97 ·
Can you refresh me, is he in a hospital tank?
At this point he might need to be to eliminate a contaminant in the environment.

I'm not familiar with Aqua-Cipro , I'll need to look it up in detail but it looks to do the same job as Kanaplex. Kanaplex is usually the big on the block with the next step being a Kanaplex / Furan 2 combo. It's rough on the fish but knocks out most everything that is infectious.
Hi Rob,

just read through everything to catch up. While I absolutely admire your dedication, at this point I would be considering euthanasia. It may not be the popular answer but you have tried countless things over the course of a few months. Bettas are sturdy little fish and he just has not improved as should be expected. He is extremely thin already and given that he refuses to eat, he just doesn’t have the physical strength/ability to recover.

Pet store bettas are notorious for being horribly inbred and sickly.

You have gone above and beyond for Curly but I think it might be time to let him rest❤
Hi Rob,

just read through everything to catch up. While I absolutely admire your dedication, at this point I would be considering euthanasia. It may not be the popular answer but you have tried countless things over the course of a few months. Bettas are sturdy little fish and he just has not improved as should be expected. He is extremely thin already and given that he refuses to eat, he just doesn’t have the physical strength/ability to recover.

Pet store bettas are notorious for being horribly inbred and sickly.

You have gone above and beyond for Curly but I think it might be time to let him rest❤
Hi and thanks for your response. To clarify, he doesn't refuse to eat at all - at least not for now. He goes for both the Northfin Betta Bits and the San Francisco Bay Frozen Spirulina Shrimp. But when the food drops from the top of the tank, he has a very hard time getting it, as his lack of fins seem to make it hard for him to swim. He certainly seems to have life in him. But for the life of me, can't figure out why he has experienced so much fin rot and that it doesn't seem to be reversing - after multiple rounds of Kanaplex and Jungle Fungus Fizz.
 

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Discussion Starter · #98 ·
Can you refresh me, is he in a hospital tank?
At this point he might need to be to eliminate a contaminant in the environment.

I'm not familiar with Aqua-Cipro , I'll need to look it up in detail but it looks to do the same job as Kanaplex. Kanaplex is usually the big on the block with the next step being a Kanaplex / Furan 2 combo. It's rough on the fish but knocks out most everything that is infectious.
Yea, we have done multiple rounds of Kanaplex and Jungle Fungus Fizz but can't seem to reverse the fin rot. Today was his one year birthday - our son was happy he's made it this far, the last betta didn't. He's eating okay, but has a hard time chasing the food - and then seems to get winded and stays at the top of the tank.

Here's a short video from just a little while ago (please excuse the off key birthday singing!): Curly Birthday Video

And a couple more shots: Curly - Week of Jan 17th, 2022

You can see he's still responsive, but the fins are still an issue. We took out the ceramic log but returned the silk plants today (for the past couple of weeks, we had nothing in the tank)
 

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Yea, we have done multiple rounds of Kanaplex and Jungle Fungus Fizz but can't seem to reverse the fin rot. Today was his one year birthday - our son was happy he's made it this far, the last betta didn't. He's eating okay, but has a hard time chasing the food - and then seems to get winded and stays at the top of the tank.

Here's a short video from just a little while ago (please excuse the off key birthday singing!): Curly Birthday Video

And a couple more shots: Curly - Week of Jan 17th, 2022

You can see he's still responsive, but the fins are still an issue. We took out the ceramic log but returned the silk plants today (for the past couple of weeks, we had nothing in the tank)
Hi Rob, happy birthday to Curly 💕! Sadly, from what I see, he looks very weak and the fin damage/rot is still extremely severe.

Since he’s been so heavily medicated over the course of the last few months to no avail, if he were my betta, I’d start considering quality over quantity of life. I hate even saying this because I know it’s so hard, but maybe at this point, you should let him live out the life he’s living very comfortably, lights off or very low, nice clean warm water with a lot of IAL’s or tea and stopping the medication. You could continue the Kordons Fish Protector since it does have stress relieving properties. Then let nature take care of the rest. I worry he may be suffering and that the meds are causing more damage instead of working to his benefit.

The other course, would be euthanasia. I recently had to euthanize one of our bettas. He was so amazing and like Curly, had extensive fin scale and
health issues. Meds gave us extra time with him, but did not give him the type of improvement it would take to give him a joyful healthy fishy life because the meds take their toll in other ways and his organs began to fail. It was a very very hard scary sad decision, but with clove oil done as instructed, he died quickly, peacefully and is in a happier place now. It’s hard to watch your pet suffer and you want to keep fighting, but we had to look at the quality of life he was living, and there was none left. We weren’t giving up on him, we were taking away the pain.

This is me though. You’ve fought hard for Curly and have been completely dedicated to him, but I don’t see any improvement in his fins and he looks unwell like he may be suffering internal issues or disease and the medications are tough on bettas little bodies.

You know I’ve been rooting for Curly all along and how much I admire your continued dedication. I know that you and your family are holding onto a miracle. I say miracle because I do believe it will take one now. These are just a couple of routes you could consider.

If you do wish to continue meds, you could reach out to @Veloran.

Take care. 🙏
 

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If he's been in fresh, clean water outside his tank where the possible contaminants are minimal, then the only other thing I can think of is the Kanaplex / Furan 2 combo. It's rough on them.
There's a good chance there's some internal issue but it would be hard to tell at this time.
I usually don't like the colored gravel, I'm always suspect about them that they're leeching something into the tank.

Wish I had more options for you.
 
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