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Discussion Starter #1
My pair had a spawn yesterday (around 50-70 eggs??) and after taking the female out the male moved the eggs into one spot. This morning the eggs were in a pile but every time I check it seems to be getting less and less eggs. I'm not sure if the male is eating the eggs or if he's been spreading them around the nest.

Will the male eat the eggs? I'm considering taking him out in case he eats them all. If I do will the fry survive without the father tending the first few days after their hatching?
 

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Males eat eggs for many reasons. The most common reason I have come across in my experience is that the eggs are not fertilized or the female is a dud.

They also eat the eggs if the environment is not deemed good enough for fry.

They may also eat the eggs if there are too many.

They also eat the eggs if it is their first time.

Lastly they can eat the eggs if they are bad dads.
Removing him is up to you. I found most of my males are actually great dads, and that the female is either a dud or I end up with WAY too many fry, and the father knew that.
 

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He will take the eggs in his mouth and move them around the nest this stopping them from getting fungus he will also eat all unfertilized / bad eggs.
Hope this helped :)
 

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Make sure he isn't putting them high up in the bubbles. Sometimes I'm surprised with the number of fry I end up with because I couldn't see them for all the bubbles. If you do decide to remove the male, the eggs and fry will be fine; even if they fall to the bottom most will hatch anyway. I had to take a male out last week and was very pleased to see the eggs hatch and the fry hanging tail down in what was left of the nest. They are very strong as none were seen falling to the bottom and struggling back to the top like other spawns I've had. Siphoning the water down to about an inch and a half will help so the fry do not have to struggle swimming back to the surface.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
sorry sena, what does dud mean?

This is both their first spawn. He seemed to tend the eggs well until this evening. Now there seems to be a few left :(
 

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Infertile can be another word :) I have one (so sad...) but have 17 fry from her anyways. Duds can be ones who result in little or no fry. All the more reason, when breeding, to have more than one female.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I have fries!!! I lifted the lid and noticed the black eyes. The dad is still tending them but not sure if I should take him out now. Last time I had fries they all disappeared the following day.

When they drop the don't move. Are they dead or is that normal? I think I saw some swimming near the surface but as soon as I noticed them I closed the lid in case I disturbed him too much.
 

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They may be weak or dead but if they are a good father will cull them for you. However some of mine have dropped down as if they were asleep. Eventually they do learn to get back up themselves.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I've taken the dad out and some fry are still swimming (about 15-20).

When is the best time to feed them BBS?
 

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I used to take the male from the spawns before i knew about eggs getting fungus and how important it is for him to keep them to the surface of the tank. I used to see them having the eggs in his mouth and that made me think they were eating the eggs but it wasn't so, although i have came across males that have eaten and entire cluster of eggs :/ and even gave them a chance to see if they would mature and stop the bad habit. Some did break the habit and some didn't. Since all the males were good breeding stock if i really needed offspring from that male in particular I would take the male out after spawning only after he tended to the eggs and placed all safely in the nest and just leave the cluster to hatch on its own, which usually took place but some eggs did sink and didn't hatch. So the importance of the male in tending to a spawn is so imperative in so many ways.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
This is my 2nd successful spawn out of 10-12 attempts. The first successful spawn I had I left the male in for the first day after hatch but all the fry were eaten when I got back. He did look after the fry as I saw him busy swimming up and down picking up the fry. I guess they all eventually died so he ate them all.

Anyway I still have about 30-35 fry swimming around in this current spawn, yay!! They're so tiny its hard to imagine them eating bbs at this size.
 

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I know what u mean some spawns the fry are so damn tiny its a worry somtime. But i never hesitate to feed bbs since they can easily starve but once you see they are free swimming just place a little bit of the bbs and observe if they chase after it and nibble at it...thats a good sign because then they will try to eat the bbs. At this stage where you are at right now most people feed infusoria or the red of the egg. But i dont do that because the water tends to get sour with the red of the egg and i dont like trying to collect infusoria, so i just feed the fry bbs.
 

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Some fry are too small to eat bbs and there are different sizes of bbs as well. I always feed infusoria for several days after free swimming in addition to the bbs. That way the smaller ones and slow starters get a chance at having something to eat and be able to compete with the bigger fry. I guess that's why I get spawns with fry counts in the 3 to 4 hundred range. My biggest to date that I actually took the time to count was 619 fry. If I ran out or had a bad batch of bbs I could save a batch of fry by taking some egg yolk and put it in a small spray bottle with water and shake it up real well. Then spray in their tank. Carefull not to over feed as it fouls the water fairly quickly.
 

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Microworms and banana worms are two of the most common first fry foods. However, they can easily pollute the tank so always clean the bottom after each feeding to avoid the bacteria building up. This can be a factor in missing ventrals in fry (from the bacteria, not the food itself). I've fed BBS to newly free swimming fry 3 days after.

Live plants in a spawn tank actually can carry daphnia and supply infusoria as first fry foods.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I will try to pick up newly hatched bbs tonight after work. If not, I may have to feed them some crushed egg yolk. I can't get hold of microworms or banana worms where I live. I heard people culture them themselves but how do you start that off?

I have live plants in the spawn tank but no signs of daphnia or infusoria unless I'm unaware of it.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I just added some newly hatched bbs into the spawn tank but they're not swimming after them?

Will the bbs foul the water if not eaten?
 

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Daphnia don't appear out of nowhere like infusoria. They have to be cultured or added to a tank at one point. An infusoria culture needs to started a week to ten days before having a goodly amount of it to feed the fry. I use a quart jar filled with old aquarium water and add a few shredded pieces of lettuce every once in a while for the infusoria to feed on. It should not smell. If it smells bad it is bad and needs to be thrown out and started over. Adding liquifry when they are still eggs promotes infusoria growth so that by the time they are free swimming there would be some in the tank. Now that they are free swimming for two days they may die off if there isn't enough infusoria on the plant roots and if they are too small to eat the bbs. A little egg yolk in a VERY clean spray bottle (any chemicals in it will kill the fry) with water, shaken up and sprayed in their tank will get them through until they can eat the bbs. Carefull not to over feed as it will foul their water. I have saved many spawns with egg yolk when my infusoria culture wasn't up and running properly or I had ran out of brine shrimp eggs.
 
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